Replying to Avatar Niel Liesmons

I don't want my Communities tied to a specific domain name.

So, either Relays need key pairs. #keylays

Or Communities need key pairs so they can switch their main relay. #communikeys

I can't sell Communities that you cannot fully own.
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Danny, the cyber guy 10mo ago

The solution is, in my opinion, neither of those options, it's relay-agnostic closed community networks that operate independently of any specific relay infrastructure, which is what I'm building :)

You need:

- **Community identity persistence** across any relay infrastructure (if ALL relays go down you as the user should still be able to access your community's data)

- **Full ownership transfer** (no relay should own ANY data about your community)

- **Multi-relay presence** for redundancy and censorship resistance

- **Encrypted communication** for communities (relays shouldn't know they're handling any particular community's data, as all the data should be encrypted and readable only by members invited to the community)

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Niel Liesmons 10mo ago

Yup, I do need all that :110percent: and this proposal gives that (and more) in a straightforward way:

nostr:naddr1qvzqqqrcvgpzp22rfmsktmgpk2rtan7zwu00zuzax5maq5dnsu5g3xxvqr2u3pd7qyghwumn8ghj7mn0wd68ytnhd9hx2tcpzamhxue69uhhyetvv9ujumn0wd68ytnzv9hxgtcqqehxjupdvvcqy654mv

https://github.com/NielLiesmons/nips/blob/master/C0.md

Do you something written out, so that I can see if it's better than key pairs?

I don't see a simpler way to get to:Check:

- unruggable, unique IDs

- Nostr-native relay access

- targeted publications

- only teaching customers one management UX-pattern

etc...

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Danny, the cyber guy 10mo ago

I don't have anything written out, but this is how it works in Eve (my community building platform):

- each community is actually a nostr public private key pair

- users run their own relay (built in to the application)

- when they publish a note, it gets saved first to their local relay, then it gets encrypted (using nip44) and published to a bunch of relays, and using a PoW specified by the community

- the relays of other members of the community pull automatically any note sent to the pubkey of the community, and if it has enough PoW (to prevent DoS), attempt to decrypt it, and if it can be decrypted, they store it in their own relay

this has some issues right now:

- all members of the community have full access

- there's no way to kick anyone out

- every member will know the private key of the community

- a compromised key results in the whole community being compromised

I'm currently in the process (almost done) of rewriting this to use MLS instead of just having one key for the whole community, which will solve all the issues I outlined, but the current way it works is perfectly fine if those cons are reasonable for your use case

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Niel Liesmons 10mo ago

> each community is actually a nostr public private key pair

That's :110percent: what I'm talking about sir!

And it's good enough (if not totally awesome) for public communities in my mind.

nostr:naddr1qvzqqqr4gupzp22rfmsktmgpk2rtan7zwu00zuzax5maq5dnsu5g3xxvqr2u3pd7qq9kxmmdd46ku6ttv4uhxrgzfht