You guys had the open discourse guy. Charlie Kirk was a buffer. You people shot out his voice. Now you get whatever you get. The window for debate is closed forever. Good job. Look inward, crybullies.
The "open discourse" right threatening a trans person on nostr and then telling them to commit suicide nostr:nevent1qvzqqqqqqypzplyvm76xqw0g9mkndxw4du939pt78qj2ufv8wtnrwp2h0ww2e7ydqy2hwumn8ghj7un9d3shjtnyv9kh2uewd9hj7qgwwaehxw309ahx7uewd3hkctcqypf5xmq22v0dzv4dz2hkz6784jy8xvx065l8lc6y39pnkazlf3gws3d4mnw
Discussion
Charlie Kirk was a Nazi who should have tried engaging in good faith discussion with people from all walks of life, and supporting free speech.
You people have never been willing to debate, why would we give a fuck that you threaten to stop debating lol
A leftist will cry out in pain while murdering you.
If you've already given me a painful injury that's making me cry out, it seems like self defense, not murder.
Or are you mixing me up with the shooter?
There is no debating leftists. That time has lapsed. Best of luck, subhuman.
Aw, you gonna cry?
Oh, is red tail a tranny? nostr:npub1z4y76jl8r5d8p63defzedngv2nrp46jgt3hyuk5v533htrycm49q66zpx6
Actually after rereading they were probably just standing up to hate in general, not trans themselves
Correct. I’m a dude who sees evidence pointing to certain conclusions worth exploring.
Been a dude since birth. No plans to change that.
Presumably Weatherall is a religious dogmatist who doesn’t know how to address facts and evidence and reason with like for like in kind.
I learned a lot from Charlie’s work. I have two large wall pieces hanging in my living room that I got through Charlie’s organization years ago. One is a Theodore Ohman lithographic print of the US Constitution. The other is an Ohman Declaration of Independence.
He and I probably agreed on quite a bit…way more than any disagreements we might have had. He was an asset for discourse.
I don't believe he was an asset to discourse, but I do wonder if the shooter should have tried to talk to him instead of shooting him
I’ll put it this way:
He created situations that gave rise to discourses that would not have otherwise happened.
Putting aside Crowder’s fall from grace involving his treatment of his wife on home camera & audio, Crowder’s Change My Mind videos were such a hit because there was such a lack of discourse. The interest was there in the public to hear well articulated points made by people prepared to present and defend their perspectives. That’s a good thing for fora to exist, much like NOSTR.
Charlie did events similar to Crowder that promoted discourse with the people. These were essentially town hall type events where anyone could step up to the mic, share their perspective and make their points.
That’s all objectively good and is in alignment with the reason free speech is sacrosanct.
As for the shooter choosing speech over violence, completely agree.
I don't think these are alike at all, I think being on nostr is a real way to promote open discourse and these events he did are just manipulative. So idk if the shooter would have had better luck trying to talk to him. But the right words can always deeply embarrass a deceptive person in front of an audience so it kinda depends if they could find the right words
Could you elaborate on what you mean by “just manipulative”?
Realistically a person can only control themselves and a person can only manage to have a deep, nuanced debate with one person at a time.
As I said, people are hungry for discourse so mics and speakers make sense so those gathered can hear.
The only thing I can think of is that you’re accusing the people who step up to the mic of being plants meant to serve up softballs. If so, do you have evidence of that? Seems like AI and face recognition and social media posts could pretty easily find out how true that theory is. Could be. Idk. I don’t think they’re all plants but they could be.
Even if they're not plants, there are tons of other issues
With the ongoing COVID pandemic many people deny, you can assume the crowd will be mostly science denialists, so the organizers definitely don't even need to do anything special to ensure a crowd of easily manipulated people
If people who actually disagree are allowed to talk, the idea must just be to psychologically bully them with how outnumbered they are in that location and reinforce the echo chamber bully psychology of all the people who came to feel the feeling of outnumbering someone
There was a story publicized on June 4, 2020, by the New York Times, about a study that was published in the New England Journal of Medicine which, in their own words from their own website is “recognized as the world’s leading medical journal and website. Published continuously for over 200 years, NEJM delivers high-quality, peer-reviewed research and interactive clinical content to physicians, educators, researchers, and the global medical community.” This article’s headline was “Malaria Drug Promoted by Trump Did Not Prevent Covid Infections, Study Finds”. The headline from the New England Journal of Medicine read “A Randomized Trial of Hydroxychloroquine as Postexposure Prophylaxis for Covid-19”. We’ll circle back to this study in a minute.
Not to elaborate at length here, and I’m sure my articulation of this will be devoid of some pedantic levels of technical nuance so those of you who may have deeper knowledge on this subject, please take this with a grain of salt and know that I’m speaking to the 80% in the middle, not the 10% at the top or bottom. Also, I’m not a doctor, but I would be happy to be corrected by doctors wherever I am incorrect.
All viruses do is replicate. Stop that and you win. Scientific research from 2019 and 2010 from BEFORE Covid became all politicized, shows, interestingly, that in cell culture studies, high Zinc ion concentrations (Zn2+) and the addition of compounds that stimulate cellular import of Zn2+, commonly referred to as "zinc ionophores", were found to inhibit the replication of various RNA viruses, including influenza virus, respiratory syncytial virus and several picornaviruses. Although these previous studies provided limited mechanistic information, this suggests that intracellular Zn2+ levels affect a common step in the replicative cycle of these viruses.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2973827/
It is well known to many doctors that hydroxychloroquine is a “zinc ionophore”. It’s actually been known in some capacity for a very long time, as evidenced by the trope of the sailor who drinks gin and tonics with limes. Not only did the vitamin C from the limes help them stave off scurvy, limes are high in zinc, and tonic water is flavored using quina bark aka cinchona bark. Quina bark derivatives are often zinc ionophores. Zinc ionophore activity has been shown in the alkaloid quinine and its chloroquine derivatives. Quinine is present in tonic water.
That’s actually important because that June 2020 study that concluded that hydroxychloroquine was not effective at treating covid 19 issued a whitepaper. I ctrl+F searched that whitepaper for the word “zinc”. I got ZERO hits.
It’s one thing for some researchers to make an honest mistake. It’s another thing entirely for “the world’s leading medical journal” to publish it and the “newspaper of record” to tout the work on the same day in lockstep.
https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2016638
The world’s largest convicted financial criminal to date, Sam Bankman-Fried was the CEO of the infamous FTX crypto exchange that blew up in late 2022. They rug pulled billions from their depositors. They also funded a bunch of politicians which is icky, but perhaps worse is the bad science they helped fund.
Social media users have spotlighted FTX’s involvement with the TOGETHER Trial, a privately-funded international research consortium conducting clinical trials to test existing drugs as treatments for various conditions, including COVID-19.
Edward Mills, co-principal investigator of the TOGETHER Trial, told Reuters by email that “no funding was received (from FTX) prior to May 2022.” Now, we COULD believe that a transaction between the largest convicted financial criminal of all time and a bogus study on the effectiveness of HCQ, as described by the recipient party, when pressed on the matter in November of 2022. Personally, I’m not prone to believe either party. One rug-pulled billions of dollars and lied for years. The other produced bunk science. I won’t go so far as to poison the well or rely upon ad hominem attacks, but speaking honestly, I’m not prone to believe what either of them says. I would err on the side that suspects they’re hiding more than just the crimes for which they were caught and imprisoned.
Mills could even be right at a technical, superficial level, but would you really be surprised to find that money made its way from SBF/FTX’s coffers into the coffers of the TOGETHER Trial long before May 2022? Given all the shenanigans, I’m more prone to approach things they say with greater skepticism than I might normally, and I think that’s fair.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33885775/
That study’s whitepaper was published in JAMA, the Journal of the American Medical Association. JAMA is a peer-reviewed medical journal published 48 times a year by the American Medical Association. It publishes original research, reviews, and editorials covering all aspects of biomedicine. The journal was established in 1883, so it’s been around over 140 years.
This study, like the one published by the New England Journal of Medicine around the same time, when ctrl+F searched for the word “zinc” produces zero hits.
Suffice to say, at this point, I’m more prone to think that a lot of “scientific work" is bogus and in need of revision. I think a lot of science funding comes from suspect channels and sources with strings attached. I think some science is even funded for disinformation or misinformation purposes by people who are incentivized to do that.
I think the above more accurately reflects the perspective of those you labeled as "science denialists". I think most of them acknowledge that if the suit tells the labcoat to jump, the labcoat's gonna say "high high". Scientists are not immune to supply line attacks on their livelihoods or the proverbial $5 wrench attack in most cases.
*"how high"
Not to beat a dead horse or anything, but one other observation I would make is that Charlie was doing this long before covid so even if your objection here is true, it doesn't explain years worth of other events.
I don't think the conservative students were out there tossing Charlie softballs.
Again, there could have been some of that but I would guess that plenty of the interactions were genuine.