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Hm, i dont see nostr:npub18nagz6a53yh6d05e8trj487dhvyfhh4qchvsz87jqng4g4zl5tvs825evl saying anything about what you people write.

> progressive, left leaning, and reformist political views

What does that even mean?

I just for fun checked wikipedia.

It's some stuff made up during the french revolution - thats a long time ago.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Left-wing_politics

Or from the age of enlightenment

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressivism

Pretty old school.

Hard to imagine what exactly that is supposed to mean in 2024.

There are political parties using such labels, but they are all the same crooked and corrupt and dont really give a fuck, so again - lip service - hard to say what anything really means.

How about just treating the whole thing as "vibing"? :-)

We know what's real is nostr.

Also bitcoin is real. Keypairs are real. Lightning is real.

A platform that promotes zapping is real.

There are many things that can be tangible and it is possible to figure out whether we do agree in a pragmatic way or not - and maybe we are coming from different backgrounds used to talk differently, use different words and language, but ...do we really mean different things?

Just a suggestion.

I'm personally "dividing" people into people who are interested in discussing topics to figure out where and why we have different views and those that are not interested and only care about building their own "team" based on color or words or whatever.

The latter ones are not really interested in left vs right or any actual debate, they are just interested in building their followers and status for the sake of it and that's quite a bit different from the actual meaning of any words used.

mbarulli 1y ago

Hi nostr:npub18y99ww94dkscfzwvvuk60sn9fyzqj66kpjj7cpvplp7fwchhvrwq93zg47,

my apologies for not being very prompt in replying.

I'm not a confrontational guy and I was quite surprised by the reactions to my post. I just broadly stated my beliefs and I got mostly harsh and sarcastic reactions where the main argument was tax=theft.

I initially tried to explain my feelings and views, but things just got worse.

I do appreciate your comment and your tone. The history of political movements is fascinating. You can find ancient roots for all current political ideology, both left and right.

Stepping back, we see these political ideas have advanced society over centuries, leading to better laws and economic conditions. At times it was the progressives advancing labour laws, other it was the conservatives creating more functional markets, ...

So, I do not agree with your view that the political discourse is just not real, made of empty words. Words mean a lot, words shaped the world we live in today and it will continue to do so.

Words may not be tangible, but they hurt. It hurt me to be called names just for saying that bitcoin is an incredible tool also for those with progressive views.

We do agree that Bitcoin is real, Nostr is real and this means a lot. They are tools we can freely use to advance our ideas, to build the thing we'd like to see in this world.

Some of us would like to live under a Bitcoin standard, with no government, small body of laws, and no taxes. Others would like to couple the Bitcoin standard with essential institutions coordinating efforts to provide equal opportunities and universal access to education, healthcare, ...

And for sure there are tens of other shapes we can envision for our society. I respect them all, I'm learning from all, I'm not sure mine is the right/best one.

Nonetheless, I have to acknowledge that I am not equipped to face rudeness and that, even here on Nostr, it is not always easy to have a stimulating conversation. Lesson learned. 😉

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Discussion

serapath【ツ】☮ 1y ago

thx for notifying me about your response. i would have missed it otherwise.

politics ... whether slavery or women with no voting rights and basically all the way up to today. politics was the rulers and privileged making the rules.

voting ... symbolically every 4 years for options presented to you by the rulers... is a farce.

all the stories in school - propaganda.

but yeah, the privileged rulers believe it is real.

it is not. the ruled are lucky that things are more peogressive today than in the past, but that is it

the 99% never had a voice or way to even express their views.

in order to change that it needs a syatem to enable this.

this would be unlike anything we have ever seen, but tech opens a lot of options - and bitcoin is a leap forward towards leveling the playing field - namely getting rid of money printers for the privileged folks.

its not words who shape the world. it is power.

words are just used after the fact to wrap things in stories ...using the right words, you can express if you are team blue or team red or whatever, but that is still ridiculous.

power comes from armies, but these days all power ultimately comes from money printers to pay for everything. ...and who has access to those is mainly inherited

serapath【ツ】☮ 1y ago

i do think everyone wants institutions.

the question is more about the money printers.

universal access to education?

youtube and the internet has done more for that than any education system recently. ..i dont see this trend reversing.

healthcare is still a big question and it is quite ridiculous that natiinal health care services end on nation borders.it is very discriminatory.

i also dont like rudeness and prefer to avoid it, but i prefer some tension but open discussion over nice phrases without real consideration.