Surely you know all Jewish people are not a reflection of the actions of their government, right?
Me when I remember who the elite is. https://video.nostr.build/36f9f696ae9eec8a8f48f74492919dd7a507c47266761d4c65435970897c44f2.mp4
Discussion
I’ll probably regret saying this considering how many idiots lurk around here, but as a Jew I can’t believe people believe this. It’s just an ethnic group. That’s it. Go home. There’s no secret cult, cabal, whatever the sheep with no critical thinking skills believe these days.
My family was dirt poor for centuries until they came to America during pogroms in Russia. All we ever wanted was to live in peace and preserve our culture.
The only “elite” is the people with the money and the power and that’s who should care about. They’ll do whatever it takes the keep the status quo, which is why we have them trying to put the blame on someone else.
So what do you think about the genocide of Palestinians?
Not all Jewish people support or condone murder. Stereotyping an entire group of human beings based on their ethnicity and/or the actions or inactions of a government is egregious bigotry.
95% of Israelis support the genocide of Palestinians. The same count for Jews living in the USA supporting AIPAC and other Jewish lobbies there that make this genocide possible.
Statistics are not "bigotry" https://video.nostr.build/c5239611722fcccda172f445a839cfa29c19d15c27e20ab4029041d9611a2e36.mp4
Asserting that 95% of American Jews and Israelis support those war crimes is insane. No one I know supports the murdering of innocent Palestinians.
Have you seen the massive protests in Israel? Obviously the issue is more nuanced than you think.
It's not nuanced; it's deeper AIPAC control the Congress. Have you seen the last visit of Netanyahu to the congress? He got interrupted by ovations many times on a Democrat leftist government that is not even the most pro-Israel as Republican Trump is.
The whole US government is controlled by them, so where are the Jews and Americans opposing this power grab?
Much comes from ignorance of these facts, I suppose, but we are in an age of information. I don't think ignorance is an excuse to be complicit with genocide.
https://video.nostr.build/131c09a378eec6c634394679fa3236a036906be40ff6023a1ae2a3f10aa1824d.mp4
What does AIPAC have to do with sentiments of people in the United States? And how is any American considered complicit when there’s nothing they can do?
I personally don’t like AIPAC at all, and I’m actually planning on running as a candidate in a third party that doesn’t accept donations like that some time far ahead in the future.
Also, the video you linked relies too heavily on hearsay, lies, and conspiracy theories. Remember, it’s antisemitic to conflate the actions of Israel with Jewish people
Americans are actually dumb as they go die war after war for them instead of refusing, but hey there's nothing they can do right.
I don't think there's any political solution but stopping any funding of these political lobbies like AIPAC, that said the government and this institutions are made of people.
They should be removed from power for treason because they are working for a foreign nation, and the first step is recognizing this, the problem to get there is when people like you call it "antisemitic."
https://video.nostr.build/4b15d09db6e17e033bc35d27c3341645b81fa8fd8cf9d98fccb2dd232e1dcc80.mp4
Even if that were true, it still proves my point. Not all Jews are Zionists, and not all Jews, American or Israeli "support the genocide of Palestinians."
In addition to stating that 95% static you provided, you also stated that Jews living in the US who are supporters of AIPAC and other Jewish lobbies get lumped into that 95% category you claim to be accurate.
The reality is far more nuanced than that. It would also be difficult to get accurate statistics from inside Israel since the population is more subject to government control and coercion.
In addition, saying the phrase, "support the genocide of Palestinians" is a strong way to try to make your point by painting with a very broad brush stroke, but it's not an accurate statement.
According to (pewresearch.org), a much more credible source than TikTok:
"An overwhelming majority of Jewish American adults (93%) say that the way Hamas carried out its Oct. 7 attack was unacceptable.
But Jewish adults under 35 are divided over Israel’s military response: 52% say the way Israel has carried out the war has been acceptable, while 42% call it unacceptable, and 6% are unsure. Jews ages 50 and older are far more likely to say Israel’s conduct of the war has been acceptable (68%)."
"Four-in-ten American Jews have a favorable view of the Palestinian people – somewhat lower than the 50% of Americans overall who say the same. Very few Jewish Americans have a favorable opinion of Hamas, which has controlled Gaza, or the Palestinian Authority, which controls the West Bank (3% and 12%, respectively)."
"When it comes to how U.S. President Joe Biden is handling the conflict, relatively few Jewish adults under 50 (35%) say he is striking the right balance between Israelis and Palestinians. By comparison, 53% of Jews ages 50 and older say Biden is striking the right balance."
"An overwhelming majority of Jewish Americans (94%) say there is at least some discrimination against Jews in America, including 72% who say there is a lot. Among Americans overall, a large majority (82%) also perceive at least some discrimination against American Jews."
Read more here:
Now, it's also very important to note that one major thing people learn when they take Statics in University is how unreliable and easy to manipulate or misrepresent they can be.
While I don't disagree that statistics are a powerful tool for understanding trends and making decisions, they must be interpreted with a critical eye, considering the underlying factors that can influence their accuracy and reliability.
Here's another statistic:
On Aug. 19, 1934, the German public voted 90 percent in favor of Chancellor Adolf Hitler becoming Führer und Reichskanzler (“leader and chancellor”), a new title created after the death of President Paul von Hindenburg earlier in the month.
Does that make all Germans evil too?
As I stated above, statistics can be manipulated or misrepresented, which is why it's crucial to understand the context, methodology, and sources behind any statistical data.
Here are some key points to consider:
Context and Definitions: The definition of what constitutes "support" can vary widely. For example, electoral support may not fully capture the extent of ideological support or complicity in a regime's policies.
Methodology: The way data is collected, such as the sample size, sampling method, and questions asked, can significantly influence results.
For instance, the 1934 plebiscite where 90% of voters approved Hitler's new role was conducted in a highly controlled and coercive environment.
Source Reliability: The credibility of the source is critical. Reputable sources like historical analyses, academic research, and well-documented articles provide more reliable information compared to anecdotal or opinion-based sources.
So, I will say it again: When one paints with dangerously broad brush strokes, stereotyping and attempting to condemn a group of human beings—an ethnic group—based on the actions or inactions of a government, religion, or for any other reason, that is egregious bigotry.
I have nothing more to say on the topic.
Well said. But nuance is hard at average intelligence. Some concepts are hard for 97 IQ to sort out and too much bother for many others.
That's why the propaganda is hard to cointeract
Great ChatGPT response 👏 😉👍
That clip is from Abby Martin, a great journalist on the topic. Discrediting it just because it is from TikTok doesn't make her words not true. I agree statistics can be manipulated. That's why it's a long topic that needs to be debated seriously before this tide turns; one can perceive what I say as "antisemitic" while I (and a lot of people) are just looking for the good jews to stop this.
I will stop here since you don't have any more say, and I don't want to see another ChatGPT response.
I know who Abby Martin is. Not that I owe your deflection an explanation, but I only used Claude 3 Opus to quickly spin up the 3 "key points to consider" bit near the end because it made sense to do so. I then edited and added to them for accuracy, clarity, and context.
I am a writer by profession, and my time is valuable. I'll take you mistaking my reply for ChatGPT as a compliment.
Really well said! Thank you for bringing nuance to an issue that is hard enough without bigotry.
Israel was built on the foundation of terrorist organizations that played pivotal roles in its early development. Organizations like Irgun were fundamental in the formation of both the government and the Israeli Defense Forces (IDF). Menachem Begin, a terrorist and former leader of Irgun, would later become Prime Minister of Israel. The interference in the land of Palestine, even prior to the Nakba of 1948, was driven by Zionist organizations whose goals were explicit: to seize as much land as possible, and to engage in the ethnic cleansing of the native population. This included not only Palestinians but also Jews who refused to convert to the Zionist ideology.
The British and the United Nations enabled this process by partitioning the region, allocating 55% of the land to the Jewish population, who were a minority at the time, and the remainder to the Arabs. Thus, the foundation of the settler-colonial state known as Israel was laid, built upon a dangerous ideology of superiority rooted in religion—a belief that places the lives of Jews above those of others.
For nearly 80 years, this process of land appropriation and ethnic cleansing has persisted. How many generations have passed under this ongoing occupation? This is why it is plausible that a large percentage of the Israeli population / I believe numbers above 90% could be true/ supports the eradication of Palestine and its people. Eight decades is enough time to deeply alter the psyche of an artificially constructed nation, comprised of immigrants from diverse backgrounds who “became” Israelis.
This is a society where there have been protests not against atrocities themselves, but in defense of the soldiers who commit them. For instance, there was a massive outrage sparked by soldiers being reprimanded for rapping Palestinians in custody, with the protests aimed at defending the perpetrators.
It is difficult to fathom the full extent of the horrors on the ground. Some argue that Zionism is even more dangerous than Fascism or Communism, due to its fusion of political and religious doctrine, making it one of the most perilous movements in modern history. Its targets are not only Arab Muslims and Palestinians but also Christians and anyone else who does not subscribe to the Zionist vision.
This influence extends far beyond the Middle East. It has infiltrated global politics, with U.S. presidents and world leaders showing their allegiance through symbolic acts such as praying at the Western Wall. Meanwhile, Palestinians are being killed every day, often with American-made weapons and the tacit approval of the Western world. This is what happens when Zionism penetrates every level of global institutions and industries, including media, entertainment, and technology.
Do you think all Jewish people are rich, deep-state powerful, murdering terrorist Zionists, or the like, or that that all Jewish people support the genocide of Palestinians?
Because, that is the dangerous stereotyping part I was speaking to.
A similar thing happened with Muslims being thought of as terrorists after 9/11 in the States, and innocent people were descriminated against and killed as a result.
You are very charitable with your time for some of these bigots 😅 I admire how thoroughly you destroy their arguments but they’ll keep squirming and deflecting. At some point it seems like a waste
Thank you, but GLACA is not a bigot.
I am friends with him and have tremendous respect for his art and friendship. I understand and share his passion for taking a stand against the atrocities of the Palestinian genocide.
We also share the viewpoint that there are powerful, hidden forces within governments and institutions (the "deep state") that exert significant influence over various aspects of society, including financial systems, political power structures, and the use of violence to maintain control.
I have had a brief conversation with him about this topic before, and I am merely seeking to get a clarification here as it relates to my point that:
People are individuals, not stereotypes. Ethnicity does not define character, and it is dangerous and unjust to condemn an entire group for the atrocities committed in the name of politics or religion.
As for the OP, that's a different story. I'm done with that conversation.
I should’ve been more clear that I was referring to “John” or OP as the bigots, sorry
All good. I assumed as much. And who knows, maybe 'John the OP' isn't really a bigot either, but just sounded like one on the internet for a moment in time. Nuance can help the willing grow. I sincerely hope that's the case.
It's all in my note. I believe that support for current genocide in Gaza could be well above 90% of Israeli population. I explained why I think so. Not all Jewish people are powerful deep-state murderous Zionists. Of course I don't think that but the scale at which they infiltrated every aspect of our reality top down is Mindblowing. It's been going on for decades and it all started with money control and now the scale of this is even hard to comprehend. Where is the growing cult of Zionism taking us? We will see but it's spreading wild and it's being shoved down people's throats in every part of western world.
Germany and US are the most alarming but so is Ukraine for example.
I think we all agree that evil Zionist ideology that is written down and well documented has to be opposed. Question is how you do it the hard way without hurting non-zionist jews.
With that said the truth about Zionist ideology should be spread widely or otherwise we might wake up in new "Nazi" reality. In fact Gaza is a way of conditioning masses at grand scale to accept these horrible babies slaughter as "normal".
I believe this is exactly where we are.
I remember we spoke about this briefly before, and we're friends. I know you're not a bigot, and you have a huge heart. My reply that you commented on was in direct response to the OP. Thanks for the clarifying reply.
I agree that hardline Zionist ideology is dangerous and the issue is extremely complex and sensitive. It's a challenging, but necessary balance to condemn oppressive actions while also not demonizing entire enthic groups.
Much love and respect, my friend.
Always love Ava. I always write from the heart. Spent time to study this problem to not sound like a bigot that I never wanted to be. Actually I still study the case of claims to the land based on ancient history vs prolonged resistance. If the world accepted the right of Return of Jews to Palestine based on ancient and Biblical connections then we should accept and cheer on for the right of return of:
Native Americans
Indigenous Australians
Ethnic Greeks
Ethnic Kurds
The problem is they don't have Zionist lobby so nobody fucking cares.
Respect.✊🏼
💯 Well said ✊🏻
Hey 👋
Populous in USA 🇺🇸 voted 🗳️ by telling Pew Research Center to quit the bombing
I’m not on ground in Israel but speaking with other Israelis you’re damn wrong. 😑 What are you king of misinformed or just a shit stiffer? Cause young man ,.. I outrank you in every way 🤣🤣🤣👼
All Jews aren't Israelis and all Israelis aren't Jews, even if they are treated like second class citizens.
Yet Israel, the only "theocratic democracy" in the mid-east, is run by gang of criminal atheists pretending to be religious followers.
That's why we distinguish Zionists from Jews and why those same Zionists what you to believe that being anti-Zionist is the same as being anti-Jewish.
But who cares? The inevitable collapse of the $$$ will mark the end of USA domination and of Israel by the same occasion.
As for the Jews, they will just carry on peacefully practicing their religion where ever they live, like they've always done.
And as for the Semites, the only true ones I know of are the Palestinians.
