This was the best one of out of the three.

Btw, I did a few interviews with Per Bylund in the recent years:

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/talks-with-petri/id1510244954?i=1000567008418

https://podcasts.apple.com/fi/podcast/talks-with-petri/id1510244954?i=1000486131555