I think many people have vastly different definitions of “decentralized”. When we talk decentralization, we should consider what good balance between cost, convenience and accountability we should apply. Take an average user of the nostr. Let’s say the use Snort, or Primal. The client is owned by one entity, relay (default one) is also owned by the same entity (snort has multiple but has its own too), media is owned by default by the same entities. In one perspective this is not a well decentralized approach by default but it’s OK for majority of the users. With Primal the wallet is technically owned by Strike on iOS, and Snort doesn’t have default (AFAIK). Amethyst or Damus on the other hand, may be considered more decentralized. Damus client, Damus relay (default) with several others, media is hosted by two different entities (NB, nostrimg). Amethyst client, no default self-owned relays (AFAIK), media is nip-96 with a lot of choices. I think that Damus and Amethyst are in good shape for the purposes of decentralization, since they can’t truly manipulate the full user experience.

I guess what I am trying to say is, you don’t have to have distributed and decentralized layers as long as each layer is not under control by the same entity. Alternative becomes more complicated and less accessible, not even talking cost of maintaining one.

#showerthoughts 🐶🐾🫡

Reply to this note

Please Login to reply.

Discussion

As running your own relay becomes easier, it'll become even more decentralised. Looking forward to that.

Your own relay will be only useful to the people who are reading/writing from/to it. Relay by definition is central to the people it is trying to connect. As long as your relay has the right people and it is controlled independently from the rest of the layers, you are in good place 🐶🐾🫡

Just make it too costly to abuse and impossible to corrupt and I am happy

What you are talking about is the user choice to use alternative tools/services and that is and important part but we have not seen any real attack on nostr yet.

If nostr.build would be taken down we would loose a lot of existing content in nostr. We could move on and recover by using a different service but it would be huge impact.

Ultimately app store bans, domain name takedowns or cease and decist orders against domain holders could be used to "censor" the network.

I'm not sure if it's good that we rely on the usual cloud providers and domain names so much, or if we should at least have decentralized P2P solutions as a backup.

It’s all the matter of compromise and cost. We are nowhere near the level of being able to afford something accessible and resilient. Plus NB is not the only game in town, there are at least 5-10 well established media hosts. And they are being used. You might have missed the time when nostrimg.com domain expired and caused a bit of blank notes 🐶🐾🫡

I can't believe that you put Snort and Primal on the same level, literally completely different.

Snort is the only client that implements the outbox model in this list and arguably the only one that's actually decentralised.

I didn’t mean to equate them, I just wanted to specify two most commonly used web clients. I am aware that Snort is completely different and much more decentralized. 🐶🐾🫂

Primal is much larger, it probably gets 3x more daily users than Snort