cat-v.org. Adnotated.
You perhaps have no idea what cat-v.org is. This would be excusable. Best I can tell currently,
mircea_popescu so basically, the cat-v story is, they had a mpi. who died. the end.
mircea_popescu well, naggum-died, but anyway.
asciilifeform happens.
mircea_popescu apparently it happens all the damned time wtf is with these people.
I suppose at this juncture it behooves me to point out that
I have no intention to kill myself,
nor did I ever have any intention to kill myselfii ;
and that while I do regard suicide as an inalienable right of the individual - if anyone tells you I killed myself hang them. For murder.
And with that, we can proceed to this here second installment of "Valiant prince MP explores the mother of all echo chambers. A saga of our times." Apparently this is a series. Who knew.
**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu 16:06:18 2016
16:06:18 * Now talking on #cat-v
16:06:18 * Topic for #cat-v is: 9front.org | cat-v.org | TOP SECRET//SI//NOFORN//CATS | prostrate yourself before the code of conduct: http://9front.org/coc
16:06:18 * Topic for #cat-v set by khm!~kfx@unaffiliated/kfx at Tue Aug 9 17:17:34 2016
16:06:18 -ChanServ- [#cat-v] Welcome to #cat-v. State your assumptions or prepare to be boarded.
16:06:18 * #cat-v :http://cat-v.org
16:06:36 mircea_popescu hello harmful people.
16:06:48 mircea_popescu i bring tidings from teh most serene republic.
16:46:57 Aram and what tidings do you bring?
16:47:09 mircea_popescu that part hasn't been decided yet.
16:48:10 aap oh, i like the most serene republic
16:49:41 mircea_popescu o.O check it out, adlai 's been quietly lurking
16:50:58 * adlai has mostly been reading the website(s)
16:51:44 * Users on #cat-v: hoodow_ Shamar dabmancer1 adlai stevie77de thortron Framedragger mircea_popescu jack_rabbit mveety_ umbraticus shardz chris2 paperwing eggstyrone sam-d spew Echoz joushou klassila smazga ndeuteron Celelibi sebbu archeus phc rxb taub_ pfallenop darvon kremlin a- pips atk zv jpm_ tlamer FRIGN sid deuteron fireglow _Raiz dv- __20h__ nocylah bipul doomcup kersnert ephe_meral _sl qwx gnusosa ringst_ qrstuv dho mischief mjl eighty6me FUZxxl rorx leetspete1
16:51:44 * Users on #cat-v: Blub\0 Cheery calston povik nm0i cjg_ mumkin fgudin joe9 slashfocus Wizzup kivutar nekomune chomzee catern copyninja acr_ stark rinukkusu tkln_ Ori_B RISCi_AT1M mkb KBme doppler moul laxask yuuko qrwteyrutiyoup SirCmpwn nichego early` kyubiko kori nelnire Robdgreat cimim farhaven cnuke nickaugust mycroftiv Aram grawk kfarwell msgctl eregus alm nmeum vehemoth oldlaptop mob_ X-Scale Orin metaglog pierre_bear rsal trn GGMethos_ liszt veikko kkn gracc_
16:51:44 * Users on #cat-v: flan ^7heo npo ftrvxmtrx whatsacompiler snuffeluffegus k0ga leetspete stateless diginet2 sl_ df hexidin Y\N cgag pr khm zxz jibanes CcxCZ acchan Padawan- aiju chi dfgg dlind_ cinap_lenrek buja zgrep Capso Fish glenda Guest796 pierreghz halon apo trqx uriel_ Nycatelos Tanami zhasha hoodow arpunk1 m4burns betawaffle echoline hiro pata aap czaks seagreen
16:53:34 mircea_popescu anyways, re tidingsiii : i just did a /names - if any of you folks want a bitcent (ie 0,01 BTC) go ahead and register your pgp key with deedbot and ima send later tonight.
16:55:16 sl_ why
16:56:23 aap finally some offers to just send the money!
16:56:26 aap someone8
16:57:33 dv- keep your filthy buttcoins
16:57:43 sl_ is there something like tlsserve for unix
16:59:01 sl_ besides ucspi-ssl
17:02:05 spew how much is a bitcent worth?
17:02:28 mircea_popescu ~same as a drink.
17:04:40 cimim $6 USD. That's a good drink over here
17:05:01 mircea_popescu !~google "five dollar milkshake"iv
17:05:10 mircea_popescu ah damn, no bots here. nm.
17:05:17 aap .theo
17:05:17 glenda We won't commit it.
17:05:20 aap .theo
17:05:20 glenda If you want it done, do it yourself.
17:05:27 mircea_popescu does it google ?
17:05:32 aap no, just insult
17:05:38 mircea_popescu not terribly useful.
17:05:42 aap .theo
17:05:42 glenda Can I ask what kind of plant are you?
17:05:51 mircea_popescu .alexandra
17:06:05 spew we're not fancy people
17:06:09 mircea_popescu evidently.
17:06:09 spew fancy people with fancy bots
17:06:47 ^7heo .theo
17:06:47 glenda There is a user community, and a development community.
17:06:58 mircea_popescu .glenda
17:07:04 dv- .terry
17:07:05 ^7heo no, there is a useful community and there is noise.
17:07:09 spew ok enough bot abuse
17:07:12 aap theo doesn't work too well today :/
17:09:18 mircea_popescu i dunno if anyone cares, but in case they do : the bot spec is over at contravex.com/trilema-bots-directory/ ; there's also a V bot base available etc.
17:09:43 doppler spew: I don't have a lot of experience with them. however, from what I gather from reading and hearing from other users, there are only a few specific reasons I'd want to use a BSD over a Linux system. (disclaimer: some of this may be false.) with Linux, you get a community and user base with a greater number of retards, you get stupid shit like systemd, but you also get much higher userland and kernel
17:09:49 doppler flexibility and higher general system performance because of high optimization. with the BSDs, you get a smaller, generally "better" community, a tighter-knit system that cannot stray nearly as far from a base system than a Linux system could, you get better support for certain specific software (like ZFS, pf, ...), but you also get a system that seems old-fashioned. they seem to miss out on some of the
17:09:55 doppler innovations (both technologies and software support) that Linux might get due to its wider use.
17:10:23 doppler spew: so all in all I like them about as much as I like a decent Linux distribution.
17:11:01 spew it's easier to use
17:11:55 spew programming is the same though OBSD compilers are so fucking old
17:12:06 spew but it's a nicer experience just using it day to day configuring things
17:12:10 spew and having things work
17:12:22 Aram openbsd added clang recently.
17:12:26 spew haven't used bsd in a long time though
17:12:31 spew Aram: yeah I heard that
17:12:38 sl_ linux is shit tho
17:13:04 sl_ an asylum constructed and staffed by inmates
17:13:15 doppler the kernel, though
17:13:23 doppler is the Linux kernel really that much worse than a BSD kernel?
17:13:40 spew I can't find my way heads or tails in the linux kernel what is going on
17:13:51 sl_ how does the kernel help you against what you will inevitably be using linux for
17:13:53 spew bsd I can read
17:13:56 doppler weird optimizations? bad style?
17:14:05 spew bad organization and style
17:14:06 sl_ too large
17:14:08 spew shit organization
17:14:16 doppler sl_: it provides an API that you use when you write programs.
17:14:32 sl_ it provides an api you use when praying to systemd
17:15:15 mircea_popescu doppler well, when was the last time bsd kernel discovered something like log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160929/#197
17:15:16 sl_ pray systemd doesnt alter it further
17:15:17 doppler the linux kernel is indeed fucking huge but it has very good support for paring down your build when you compile
17:15:37 spew doppler please be serious
17:15:52 doppler it does!
17:16:01 doppler (see also: all the embedded shit that runs Linux)
17:16:13 sl_ what does linux do that you cant get from freebsd at this point
17:16:13 mircea_popescu ...
17:16:17 doppler there's a lot more embedded linux devices than embedded BSD devices
17:16:27 doppler sl_: do? probably nothing.
17:16:31 sl_ you requirements seem fluid
17:16:42 doppler well yeah
17:16:43 mircea_popescu sl_ i am wondering if he is trolling or what.
17:17:08 doppler good one, mircea_popescu.
17:17:15 spew doppler you're saying this horrific steaming pile of shit is ok because there's a really good system for decontaminating yourself
17:17:20 doppler no.
17:17:23 spew you are
17:17:29 doppler I'm not meaning to.
17:17:40 mircea_popescu doppler that kinda... "fluidity" is usually an indicatorv, what can i tell you.
17:17:42 doppler the BSDs all contain some amount of cruft too
17:17:46 spew yes
17:17:49 sl_ its not necessary for me to tear down linux, its necessary for linux to demonstrate some worth
17:17:50 spew they certainly do
17:17:59 spew I can still figure out what is going on in the BSD kernel
17:18:08 spew I give up before I get anywhere whenever I poke around in linux
17:18:15 doppler I completely understand that
17:18:22 doppler that is a really important aspect
17:18:26 doppler being able to grok kernel code
17:18:27 sl_ i concluded in 1999 linux is more trouble than it is worth
17:18:38 sl_ and the situation has only deteriorated since then
17:18:40 spew I concluded this year that linux is unavoidable
17:18:47 doppler but you asked about my opinion
17:18:50 sl_ sure
17:18:51 doppler I don't do anything in the kenrel
17:18:55 doppler *kernel
17:19:02 doppler (not yet)
17:19:12 spew I guess I should try to switch to freebsd and see if the linux emulation is enough
17:19:21 doppler I've wondered about that, too
17:19:23 spew I have to use all this shit that's just linux
17:19:37 spew really just docker and oracle java
17:19:57 Aram every half decade I have to do some linux kernel stuff, and it's always different. they changed everything during this time. while half of the design and implementation of 4.4 BSD still applies 21 years later.
17:20:17 spew that's a good point too
17:20:26 spew because 4.4 bsd actually had a design and implementation
17:20:30 spew linux just had an implementation
17:20:32 doppler spew: like, especially in a situation like that, there's something to be said for "I can just slap Linux on it and it works". you don't debug the kernel on the same machine that you run docker on, do you?
17:20:34 mircea_popescu incidentally, is there a log of this channel anywhere that i could read ?
17:20:39 Aram no log
17:20:45 doppler read topic
17:20:53 mircea_popescu deliberately or through neglect ? ah ok lessee.
17:21:02 sl_ ask your congressman
17:21:03 Aram deliberately
17:21:18 doppler mircea_popescu: like, "no logging allowed".
17:21:20 mircea_popescu the coc thing is... two lines ?
17:21:31 cimim refresh it
17:21:35 mircea_popescu doppler how does this get implemented in practice ? my client logs by default for instance ?
17:21:38 spew doppler: I never debug the kernel, I work for webshit
17:21:44 mircea_popescu o hey, greek.
17:21:45 Aram the no bots/no log rule has ben removed from this channel's topic
17:21:45 doppler dudepublic logging
17:21:49 Aram it used to be there
17:21:53 doppler s/dude/&, /
17:22:01 mircea_popescu excuse me if i am a little confused.
17:22:14 spew you are excused
17:22:14 sl_ its just that nobody cares
17:22:26 mircea_popescu so : there's a code of conduct that contains nothing ; there's some old rules which i can't know because there's no public logs so new people can't view the history...
17:22:28 sl_ and log police are generally annoying
17:22:29 mircea_popescu who designed this ?
17:22:43 spew cat-v is like linux
17:22:47 spew implemented but not designed
17:22:47 mircea_popescu evidently.
17:22:51 sl_ its anarchy
17:22:53 doppler haha
17:22:54 sl_ deal with itvi
17:22:58 doppler nerd
17:23:00 sl_ .gif
17:23:00 mircea_popescu ic.
17:23:14 khm 13:13 there's a lot more embedded linux devices than embedded BSD devices
17:23:17 khm haha.
17:23:22 sl_ inferior candidates have a way of wandering off on their own
17:23:43 doppler khm: I've only seen network appliance shit that runs BSD, and it's probably only because it has pf.
17:23:47 Aram I don't want linux in my washing machine; what sort of argument is that?
17:23:53 doppler khm: please inform me
17:23:56 mircea_popescu sl_ about same as the republic, except for the voice enforcement and pgp usage. and the public logs. and the bots. and the money and the etc. but yeah, i see.
17:23:58 khm 12:59 how much is a bitcent worth?
17:24:00 khm nothing.
17:24:03 sl_ mircea_popescu: http://9front.org/coc
Friday, 30 September, Year 8 d.Tr.