Nostr Web Client

Could you elaborate a bit more on where the funds are “stored”. You say the chip has cryptographic keys but it’s on lightning. Does the chip have its own lighting channel with the LN server or some sort of LSP?

How do you verify no one extracted the sats from the coin?

Tuvok 7mo ago

yeah, sure can do. ---> the fund are on the lightning server

key pairs can be used to all kinds of stuff

the chip is just like a boltcard so you could setup it today

the chip just pays a payment over the lightning network, normally

BUT you could just "check" the balance of the chip with nfc reader

and then trade the coin if you got enough "trust"

so its not the safest way right now

but i showed it to bitcoiners yesterday

and they all have been very interested

maybe i should just make a video

hope it helped a little

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Discussion

Setor 7mo ago

Thanks for elaborating. So if I understand correctly, the trust component is that the lightning server could rug you? What’s the key pair for?

Boltcards are connected to the lightning server as well. What’s the technical difference to the boltcard, as one wouldn’t use the bolt card as a physical way to exchange sats?

Or am I overthinking and it’s just meant to be used like a boltcard but the form factor is different?

Tuvok 7mo ago

yes the formfactor is much better,

you would better think of it as a wallet

which you can give completely to another user !

with a card i never thought of this feature, but now it looks different.

the use of key pairs is better then using eCash in an offline way

because eCash you can just copy !

but with keys you can sign any event on the LN server and you cant easily copy the chip

thats the point... i could use a ntag 213 and just put ecash on the chip

but we know the trade offs right ?

Setor 7mo ago

Actually I don’t even know what ntag 213 is. I have not dabbled in physical transfers in Bitcoin yet. Only heard of opendime. So in my head I’m comparing the tradeoffs to that.

Why would I want to sign with the keys on the chip. The chip has its own key pair which is not related to the server right?

Tuvok 7mo ago

the chip can sign an LN server event and send or receive funds,

Setor 7mo ago

Hmm I’m not really sure what this means. An explainer video is probably helpful. I feel like I’m missing some information to properly understand what this product would exactly do and why I would prefer it and also why somebody would be willing to take it (so “Sender” and “receiver” tradeoffs)

Tuvok 7mo ago

the goal is offline cash backed by sats !

but yes i will make a video

its just a little work 😅

Setor 7mo ago

A video is not a hard thing I’d need, just said that because you mentioned it before. Technically I’m just interested in why would someone want to receive the physical coin. Let’s say I’m a merchant or for that matter anybody who I’m not affiliated with in anyway.

Does having the coin somehow guarantee that I can claw the fund from the LN server? Or is it just a gimmick and I’m overthinking?

Tuvok 7mo ago

the security part is the interesting one

and i guess it could be achieved

right now i would only use as a gimmick

to showcase sats to

normal people

but yes if you give someone the chip, he can withdraw the funds later...

trustmodel should be considered

so it would only work with friends and family

but development on the security of the chip

could boost it to real world cash backed by cyberspace sats !