I like the idea of no state but china would not have advanced like this without one.

The state apparatus is a powerful thing, whether you believe it's right or wrong.

Small self governing communities don't build mega cities and high-speed rail.

They mostly just raise livestock, grow vegetables, make craft to trade etc.

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Does the government build mega cities or do people build them? We’ve had roads without income tax. We don’t need government at all

A lot of a roads were built by prisoners using truancy laws.

I’m not familiar. Can you elaborate?

Post civil war when the country was expanding and roads were being built the nation had strong truancy laws. Basically loitering was a 6 month prison sentence as soon as someone was released they would immediately be arrested again.

So they had bs laws intended to extract free labor from people?

😂

Isn’t that the way

Possible

End one grift start another

The human condition

It is

A tragic comedy

You have to laugh so you don’t cry

Prison slave labour is the backbone of USA's entire economy.

They used to heavily rely upon prison slave labour to build roads, but these days they use them to staff McDonald's and manufacture stuff in factories

Workers build everything, government is just the system used to organise people.

Anarchism is a form of government.

But I know you're using government to refer specifically to the state. Just wanted to clarify that.

I'm 100% against income tax and rates.

(Rates are the tax that people usually justify because of muh roads)

These days income tax literally provides nothing, that money gets destroyed to control inflation.

China doesn't even have rates, funnily enough.

They tax their citizens a lot less than the West.

But it's a command economy where the state directs the economy.

It was state policy that created the environment in China for the workers to build all of this.

I do have hope for a better world where people and communities are sovereign and the state doesn't exist. But it's just a utopian dream at the end of the day.

Something to work towards that we'll probably never achieve.

100% true, but its not the whole picture.

Beiyang China was best China. Killed no more than a few hundred thousand innocent people over two decades.

KMT bodycount hit the millions, CCP the tens of millions before they arrived at systems that allow initiative and investment.

Its nice what they have now, if you're wealthy like my friend in HK. But the failure modes of Statism are really not nice.

You say that like mega-cities and high -speed rail are a good thing.

High-speed rail and automobiles have robbed mankind of the horse-human relationship. It's very sad.

They're certainly a good thing if you have lots of people. If you are for mass murder and castration than you can change things into a world wide Mayberry again.

We need high speed rail with horse carriage so people can take their horses over long distances and use the horses for local transport when they arrive.

Seriously though, I fully agree with you.

One of the saddest things about my town is when one of the horse paddocks in town gets sold off to developers to build detached houses with a full acre of lawn each.

Every year I see less and less highschool kids riding around on horses.

less and less land in town to keep horses.

More and more kids who want to learn to ride or keep a horse have to travel out of town via car to see their horses now.

This is not objectively good or bad