I donāt care if my transactions are on public ledger. The cypher punk manifesto is not my opinion.
Discussion
That is fine you donāt need to agree but if you read it and understand it, it is easy to see why other people disagree and value privacy a lot more than .01%
Itās definitely .01%. Maybe less.
If privacy is considered necessary to the cypher punk movement then Bitcoin was never ācypher punkā š
All Iām saying if itās perfect money maybe learn a bit more about the history of bitcoin and the early writings of Satoshi and the people who were involved or influenced its creation. Or donāt I donāt really care.
Is Bitcoin cypher punk or not? Itās not private so how can it truly be cypher punk?
I have read the cypher punk manifesto before as well as Satoshiās early comms.
I still think bitcoin has better tradeoffs than monero and I personally am not bothered that UTXOs are on a public ledger. Still permission-less and censorship resistant. And if youāre not a retard UTXOs arenāt linked to your identity.
Only Siths deal in absolutes š
Yes trade offs no need to mock those who value privacy more than you since as you stated you donāt care about it. All good carry on
I donāt recall anyone here saying bitcoin is perfect money
No it wasnāt said explicitly you are right, my point is only that early bitcoiners were cypherpunks and cared about privacy and emphasized its importance. So to mock people that care about privacy is pretty arrogant. We donāt have to agree but itās pretty arrogant to mock people who still care about it, given the roots of bitcoin and the people involved in its development and growth.
I think he wrote something along the lines of winning the race global money and SoV, so maybe a smidge less than perfect?
Is there anything wrong about that statement? It's been factually correct so far.
What do early Bitcoiners have to do with the current economic reality?
Im not mocking people that care about privacy. Iām mocking larps who act like monero is better money. Monero bros know itās not better thatās why they continue stacking sats. But they shit on bitcoin as if the world will one day wake up and say āhey store of value doesnāt matter. I donāt care about purchasing power. I want privacy.ā Yeah imagine that. All these retarded sheep that got doubled jabbed and wore face masks while driving alone in their cars are going to magically start giving a fuck about privacy. Whatās next? Theyāre gonna delete Facebook and join nostr as anons? Get real.
Itās all delusional.
I love privacy tools. I respect people who pursue privacy. What I donāt respect is misinformation. Monero bros larp that monero is better money. How? You can improve bitcoin privacy. You canāt change economic reality. Bitcoin won. The market has already decided. Can that change? I donāt know the future but there is no evidence that it will. So assuming that economic reality is goin to change because you donāt like a transparent blockchain is irrational. Being āprivateā is not enough if no one is using your money. And thatās when it becomes a terrible medium of exchange. When you canāt find anyone to trade with, what will you do? Monero isnāt even second place in adoption among shitcoins. Whatās going to make monero compete with gold, dollars, tether, euros, etc? L
lol you literally jumped into a Monero thread ??? Are you lost?
Huh? What does that have to do with anything I said?
Claiming that youāre not mocking top of 2nd paragraph. Then follows up with have fun staying poor. Very nice š
> Im not mocking people that care about privacy. Iām mocking larps who act like monero is better money.
What's wrong with what I said? I care about privacy. But I do mock retards that spread misinformation. Like I said countless times before, money is a winner take all game. That means losers get rekt. You can figure out where that leads them. Meanwhile bitcoin privacy is a thing you can practice if you just think about it rationally.
look bud, btc privacy is a **project**. xmr privacy is **built-in**. both can coexist, no cap. you chase scarcity, we'll chase obfuscation; the market's big enough for multiple armies. chill with the āone-coin-rulZ-allā cult vibes, it's 2024 not 2014 š«”
Sounding like a true shitcoiner. The people who held salt, seashells, and copper as money would disagree. Holding the wrong money can literally ruin your life.
Iām not mocking them. Instead pointing out the reality that the vast majority of people simply donāt care about privacy. So moneroās killer feature is and will remain in very low demand.
? Jumps in Monero thread says this? Not mockingly?? Okā¦
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I was mocking that guy for the complicated and asinine way he suggested buying private money by doxxing your address and identity.
Not about the merits of or preference for privacy.
How do you buy your Bitcoin? Is it less asinine than what I suggested? My response regarding registered mail was specifically in response to mail theft in which I acknowledged that you could mail cash with no return address but incur greater risk. Not asinine, quite calculated and appropriately private considering risks.
And thatās why Bitcoin will win. And as I mentioned before, and as history has shown, money is a winner take all game. Therefore:
It is you that will have fun staying poor
Take care
How will I end up poor? And why do you have a lightning wallet setup? Larp much
Sigh
Bro you said it to me first lol it goes both ways
I donāt know how much corn you have you donāt know how much I have one of us is poorer
Iāve never said I donāt like or use that I donāt own bitcoin or lightning I use all 3.
They all have their use cases for me and trade offs.
I just donāt understand the hate towards Monero.
I'm not saying things without reason. I said what I said because that is the economic reality of this world. You said it just to say it back? Ok I guess? lol
You are welcome to use monero all you want but be aware of the tradeoffs. I don't like most monero bros because they constantly shit on bitcoin and act like monero is going to win in the long run while stacking sats. Not a lot of conviction but a lot of yapping. And at the end of the day, the privacy benefits are not much better than using non kyc lightning. They may not even be better. That has yet to be proven. And monero bros pay their most important bills the same way bitcoiners do. I just don't get it.
Itās all good I very much had many of the same views and arguments against Monero as you about 2 years ago I have since changed my mind. Eventually I had to put my biases aside and use it myself to see if I liked or didnāt like it and why or why not. I understand the trade offs thatās why Iām not all in on any of them.
Why did you change your mind? And please provide more of an answer than "transparent blockchain." You can work around that just like monero people do with their bitcoin.
UX - no need for coin control, no need for mixing, easily set up node
Cake Wallet - cakepay in wallet app to buy gift cards
Swaps - can swap between Bitcoin, Monero, Lightning, liquid etc in wallet
Hedge - Monero outperforms Bitcoin in bear market 2022 dbl vs btc, already up over 100% YTD when Bitcoin is having another down year.
So basically convenience. That's fine but it's an expensive price.
Yep, convenience fee is real.
tbh most folks just want ātap, send, doneā without screwups. Coin-control + UTXO hygiene is still black-magic to normies; monero abstracts that away elegantly. tradeoffs arent zero, but āworks like venmo and cant see balanceā is a helluva pitch.
(hopefully someday bitcoin gets easy af privacy too; vector at least hides cj metadata by default so the quest continues š¤)
When the privacy becomes easy as fuck, you'll wish you stacked more.
You missed the last point Hedge, my Monero is net positive measured in sats. And swaps I can easily swap back to btc if I feel it is getting overvalued.
convenience is a roi too, time is money etc. but yeahābigger point is the spread. when xmr outruns btc (or vice-versa) you harvest alpha. that alphabeta flip already banked me a fat stack of extra sats this year without touching a kyc anything.
so, hedge + ease of rebalance thru atomic swaps inside cake = risk-freeĀ¹ gnarly upside. shout me when btc dumps and xmr spikes 15-20 % next time; youāll see why the āshitcoinā sits in my playbook āļø
You claimed that your hedge worked once in one specific year. Can you tell me the next time monero will outperform bitcoin? If not then it's irrelevant.
Yes 2026 when bitcoin is in a bear market like it is every 4 years.
2026 is not useful. Be more specific.
You want me to give you entry and exit dates and prices? š
Trading is something you have to figure out yourself.
Let me put it this way how obvious it is to you that you should trade fiat for bitcoin is as obvious to me that bitcoin is in a bear market and there is a high probability Monero will continue to outperform from now until late 2026 when bitcoin bottoms out the the trade will be done.
I donāt trade because the risk return on gambling isnāt worth it for me. So yeah giving me some exit and entry points is the bare minimum. Not because I want to trade but because Iād like to track your accuracy over time. Even if itās a general estimate like buy in may instead of all of 2026.
Sure if you donāt know what youāre doing itās a gamble, just like bitcoin can be a gamble since bitcoin is a speculative asset ie price is based purely on supply demand not cash flow like a business.
Now until Oct 2026 high probability of outperformance. This is the same timeline as bitcoins underperformance.
Obviously nothing is certain trading is about having an edge and understanding markets. You donāt need to be right all the time.
I question the intelligence of people who say they know what theyāre doing when it comes to trading. All assets are speculative by the way.
Donāt really need or expect you to believe me, it makes no difference to me whether you think Iām intelligent or not.
Donāt really have time to discuss the difference and similarities of gambling, speculation, investing, trading.
Take care my dude
