I imagine you will be zapping all the artists you listen to on this stolen archive of musicians and writers life work- right?
Discussion
Spotify owes them the money, not the people listening to it on torrent.
Spotify told these artist that their creation will be protected. And obviously it wasn't so it's Spotify's responsibility to pay the creators.
I agree with thisâŚ
The artist need to sue the shit out of SpotifyâŚ
Hope this takes Spotify downâŚ
And ruins trust in the industry for platformsâŚ
But all of those are highly unlikely unfortunately
Nothing happens until people cancel their subscriptions. And we know that's not gonna happen because no one cares that all the music got leaked. No one cares because they're gonna continue to pay their subscriptions.
đ¤ˇđ˝ââď¸đ¤ˇđ˝ââď¸đ¤ˇđ˝ââď¸đ¤ˇđ˝ââď¸đ¤ˇđ˝ââď¸đ¤ˇđ˝ââď¸đ¤ˇđ˝ââď¸ hahahahaha
Agreed
Nahhh no mame wey. A mi me vale verga que le paguen una mierda a los artistas con tal de poder escuchar mĂşsica a un precio modesto.
Not defending Spotify because I share your disdain for them, but thatâs not how music distribution works. Artists go through a distributor like Distrokid, CD Baby, etc, who then put their music on various streaming platforms including Spotify, Apple Music, etc. Most artists know theyâre not going to make anything from Spotify, but they want their music there because thatâs where the industry says it needs to be. The absolute best thing you could do for a musician you like is to directly send them money for their music to support them. Zaps make it easy on Nostr, but whatever the platform support them directly.
I agree Spotify does not pay their artists enough.
I do not agree with stealing artist's work and not compensating them when you consume it.
How can one justify stealing from another because another is stealing from them too?
That is a double theft.
Get your wallets loaded up and zap them - great way to onboard new artists to NOSTR. đ
Iâm conflicted but my disdain for Spotify is at least 10 times stronger than for any pirate.
Thatâs why I took my music off that platform some years ago. Fuck Daniel Elk (heâs not a real elk). The only way forward is for us to remove ourselves from his shitty website, then thereâs nothing for Annaâs Archive to extractâŚ. Unless they want loads of Joe Rogan lol.
Go to a concer or buy merch directly on their website if you actually want to support them
Totally AND zap them and get them on NOSTR
Just like i zap developers every time i open their program or zap paint artists every time i look at their painting.....not! I will gladly zap and pay in any currency when they perform for me in any way (live, online stream, whatever) or buy something from them (shirts, whatever...) but pay each time i listen? Yeah right.
This is theft. No matter how you look at it. This makes everything every artist has ever made free. If a library of books was stolen like this there would be lawsuits. I expect Spotify will sue over this, not that I support them or this activity. But I don't know what good will come out of lawsuits by a company only interested in self-preservation. What we need is an instant, global, frictionless way for fans to support art directly. Oh wait.... we have that! #nostr #bitcoin #lightning #lightningislove nostr:nprofile1qy2hwumn8ghj7etyv4hzumn0wd68ytnvv9hxgqgdwaehxw309ahx7uewd3hkcqpqyfg0d955c2jrj2080ew7pa4xrtj7x7s7umt28wh0zurwmxgpyj9sldm58v nostr:nprofile1qy2hwumn8ghj7etyv4hzumn0wd68ytnvv9hxgqtxwaehxw309anxjmr5v4ezumn0wd68ytnhd9hx2tmwwp6kyvtkx46kv7tgx3kxketnd3nhs7rrvdkxwwrxxp585ct6dpshwdmjwdexsanxw96hs7ndxfnxkd35vvmny6rswv6r2m3swc6n7cnjdaskgcmpwd6r6arjw4jsqgr98zf9a0akv86p3kx86p6tachg4lthsuqamzg8psk6jdk4w8j4cv6qcgkr @truefans #grownostr âĄď¸ We are almost there đ¤đť I desperately hope fans will support artists directly in the future. đ§Ąđ
> This is theft. No matter how you look at it.
Nothing was stolen, Spotify still has all their copies and theyâre in the same state as prior.
So no, itâs not theft, no matter if you emotionally want to label it that because you donât like it, but thatâs simply not what happened here.
Itâs stealing from the artists.
Does the artist own the bits on my computer which produce the file to play their song?
No, they do not. Nor do the artists own the files on Spotifyâs servers.
Welcome to the world of infinite near zero-cost digital reproducibility. Understanding this properly will help you understand #Bitcoin better.
Gee thanks for the lesson. This isnât a matter of understanding bits. Itâs a matter of integrity.
No, itâs is a matter of understanding reality.
Applying an incorrect moral lens (âintegrityâ) which doesnât meet technical nor legal reality is vapid and pointless.
You just want to feel good about yourself by making baseless allegations about âstealingâ because you havenât bothered to actually learn enough to discuss the topic and so act from a purely emotional, and entirely immature standpoint.
I feel so blessed that you have shown up to help me understand reality. Phew. What a relief.
Iâm quite sure when you open your wallet, you understand this reality quite well âDJ Valerieâ.
You choose to ignore it because you refuse to accept reality as it is and rather, like a child, prefer to live in a construct which coddles your weak mind.
It sounds like you need a hug.
Sending one your way. đş
nostr:nprofile1qyt8wumn8ghj7cnfw33k76twv4ezuum0vd5kzmqpz4mhxue69uhk2er9dchxummnw3ezumrpdejqqgru5ek5ze43da22z6rgryd6r33cd2tkvf85vd8n39keke6q5wyv5vus75gh I understand the arguments from all sides but with music, movies and books creators are spending huge amounts of money to create art that should be protected or monetizable - at minimum so creators can continue to make more art. This is the first I knew about Anna's Archive. It appears you have to be a member of Anna's Archive to access the copied content they "preserve" under the guise of a non-profit freedom hub. But I did not distribute my music to Anna's Archive or give them permission to copy it freely. So it's not emotional, it is theft. I want the music I create to be available to anyone who wants to hear it but I have to find a way to be compensated for the $12,000 US dollars I spent to make the record(s). If art is not monetizable then we will all be relegated to AI Slop for the rest of eternity. I don't know about you but I'd still love to discover and follow and support my favorite artists in the world. The issue is that we have never had a way to do that (support with money) across borders and electronically. That is what Bitcoin Fixes. It's a beautiful solution to a100 year old problem. My hope is that we see people build solutions that support the creation of art, not kill it.
> âshould be protected or monetizableâ
It IS protected by copyright law - thatâs not the issue.
The problem is that copyright law applies within legal jurisdictions. US law doesnât apply to someone like me in Vietnam, or to servers in jurisdictions that donât recognise American IP law, yet weâre all connected to the same internet. The bits can be copied regardless of what any law says âshouldâ happen. You can say âshouldâ as much as you like, but unless youâre willing to work with reality as it is, youâre not going to make progress.
Annaâs Archive doesnât require membership, their content is freely accessible.
And Annaâs Archive doesnât need your permission to copy bits any more than I do. The entire internet functions through copying. When Spotify plays your song, it copies bits to the listenerâs device. This note that I wrote exists as a copy on your device - can I gatekeep you from reading it? No.
This is why calling it âtheftâ is nonsense. For something to be theft, you have to be deprived of your property. If I take your car then you canât drive it - ergo you have been deprived.
In the digital realm you still have your copies, they still work exactly the same, your property is unviolated. Whatâs on my device is my property; whatâs on yours is yours. The same bits can exist in both places simultaneously. This is fundamentally different from physical goods.
You can make whatever moral arguments youâd like, but this debate has been running for 30+ years and reality keeps smashing creators who go against it. Youâre not going to change how computers and the internet work.
I believe nothing will improve for artists in the digital age until they stop fighting gravity and learn to harness it. Arctic Monkeys built their career through viral sharing on MySpace. Saifedean actively encourages people to pirate âThe Bitcoin Standardâ and heâs still sold over a million copies. It can be done.
Because you make nothing from people who arenât fans. The only way to get fans is exposure. Someone who pirates your album and loves it might buy merch, come to shows, tell friends, or simply pay you directly once Bitcoin makes that frictionless. Someone who never hears your music because itâs locked behind a paywall will give you nothing, forever.
Itâs far better to capture 1% of a million listeners than 100% of a thousand. Youâre never going to gatekeep your way to a million fans but widespread free distribution might get you there.
If youâd like to understand this topic instead of just emotionally reacting to your situations, Iâd recommend Stephan Kinsellaâs book on the subject:
https://annas-archive.org/md5/b8e5915a387336529c79a31baf4b5a02
nostr:nprofile1qyt8wumn8ghj7cnfw33k76twv4ezuum0vd5kzmqpz4mhxue69uhk2er9dchxummnw3ezumrpdejqqgru5ek5ze43da22z6rgryd6r33cd2tkvf85vd8n39keke6q5wyv5vus75gh I'm not at all emotional. Not sure how many more times I'll need to tell you that. I'm just giving my perspective and you are coming after me and everyone who has commented on this thread. Discovery has been broken for over a decade. Spotify and TikTok killed real fan discovery for everyone. The Arctic Monkeys - and Taylor Swift - were both lucky to have My Space to help them build their fan bases (that was almost 25 years ago. Nostr could be the "my space" for my generation of artists. But the truth is there isn't enough traction yet. I have been one of the VERY LUCKY few who have been able to reach new people and make a lot of new friends around the world using Nostr. I have seen success in getting my music heard by new people and many here on Nostr have supported me - generously. But the 2,000 or so other artists on Nostr (many of my friends) have not seen the same results, and it's not because they don't have great art. There are just not enough people here, willing to support this new music economy with their own personal Bitcoin. I don't know how it is in Thailand, but I can tell you in the U.S. it's hard to get people to part with their sats. So, until every artist, or at least the good ones, can come to Nostr and have the same experience I have, then we have to admit we just are not there yet. Without some initial return of value (or return on investment), artists will eventually "go out of business." AI has already shown us that if you want free art, it's usually slop. So, As I said in my last message, I get it. I understand your arguments. I just don't think that the vast majority of the world wants bad art for the rest of eternity. Film, TV and books all have the same issues I'm raising here for music. It's not about wanting paywalls, it's about finding and connecting with the people willing to support the art we create. We need tools that enable that, discovery with value enabled. Value 4 Value Music has shown it can be done. We need to figure out how to scale it in a way that will help artists find a better more creatively fulling future. Peace Out! Keep on Rocking in Thailand đ¤đť
If youâre looking to Nostr to help you with discovery youâre more lost than I thought. Nostr sucks for discovery and it will never be good at it. Youâve fundamentally misunderstood the purpose of #nostr and how it works if you thought it would do that for you.
If you want Nostr to be the âMySpace for your generation of artistsâ then youâre going to need to learn what it actually does well, and seek to harness that to your advantage instead of wishing for things it will never be.
> But the 2,000 or so other artists on Nostr (many of my friends) have not seen the same results, and it's not because they don't have great art.
No, likely itâs because like you, they donât understand technical realities and instead of listening to people who do, they rather spend their time talking about how things âshouldâ be.
You could all be harnessing Nostr and building it together towards your needs but instead youâre all just upset it didnât materialise into what you wanted it to be and waste your time arguing about reality.
> I just don't think that the vast majority of the world wants bad art for the rest of eternity.
Youâre betting on that with your livelihood as an artist. I am not.
I also understand these technologies much better than you given my entire career was built on assessing bleeding edge tech and I would not let my kids bet their future on this assumption.
But youâve already made that bet. Youâre here now.
So how about instead of arguing with someone who actually knows a whole bunch of stuff you donât, you try learning something?
Your entire premise is wrong. What you think about IP, is wrong. What you think about distribution is wrong. What you think Nostr could help you with is wrong.
If you want Nostr to be your MySpace, you make it your MySpace. You funnel everyone to your Nostr presence. You donât post on Xitter or Insta or anywhere else - if your fans want your stuff they get it on Nostr and you commit to that.
You funnel your fans to your Nostr presence, and your 2000 artist friends do the same, between you you can template a better experience for fans, and you commit to that flow knowing you may never make money but that youâre building the thing you want to exist for other people like you so that art isnât all AI slop because you care about that so much.
Maybe youâre lucky and do make money, but if I was going to bet here Iâd bet youâll ignore my note, dismiss me because I didnât affirm what you wanted to hear, spend the next years talking about what âshouldâ be and drop off Nostr in the next year or two because you didnât ever really understand any of this stuff even though people like me tried to explain it to you.
Of course I hope you succeed because your success will be nostrâs success. But you and Valerie both strike me as the types who will give up when reality doesnât bend to their will even though you canât acknowledge reality for what it is.
Donât waste your time arguing with negative people who resort to attacking others and who think itâs ok to steal art.
He needs a hug.
Just make great music and carry on Ainsley. đśđşâŽď¸đĽ°
Define âstealâ Valerie.
Iâll wait right here whilst you do that and try to reconcile your point with the reality of Digital bits.