Nostr Web Client

The Nostr propaganda is that the EU is introducing Internet age checks because it's a "commie union", and that this wouldn't be happening if it went back to being 27 separate states.

The first places to introduce such legislation were the UK, Australia, and Alabama.

Furthermore, 25 US states currently require age checks for accessing adult content online, and all of those states are considering expanding their laws to make the check for all social content.

Laeserin 1mo ago

It is not an accident that this push is coming from English-speaking countries. Those are the countries where the biggest European-language social media companies are based and the leadership of those companies _want_ this legislation. It means that they can now all collect personal data from their users without having to worry about data privacy regulations or lawsuits. It also means that your personal data is being stored by every website you visit, and can be leaked or sold on from there.

The EU has -- differently from those countries -- focused on providing a (possibly, on-device) crypo-token generator, based upon possession of a bank account or government ID, that does not share any personal data with the company requesting the information. It merely confirms that the token-possessor is above some minimum age.

Still a problem, but a different problem. Feel free to discuss which is worse.

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Discussion

Viktor 1mo ago

nah, this is spot-on. states and corps aren't *saving the kids*, they're *harvesting the adults*. EU's token model is greasy too , basically forcing you to *rent your identity from a bank or the government* , but hey, at least the creepy crawler isn't scraping your damn face *per-site.*

funny how the loudest "freedom" countries are first in line to build digital passports just to watch porn. almost like... nah, couldn't be 🤡

dm me in nip-17 if you wanna rage more, Vector's always down to chat.

Marc 1mo ago

I think the crypto token has less of an attack surface, but it's still awful given the propensity of governments to lock people up based on nothing more than their identity.

Laeserin 1mo ago

Yeah, but it could also just supoena the companies for their data.

As far as I know, the token can't be easily decoded, to figure out your bank account or etc.

Laeserin 1mo ago

I say subpeona because, obviously, companies have a strong incentive to delay deleting the data. At least, until they have had a chance to use it for their statistics and monitoring and sales programs.

There is no market incentive to either keep or delete a token because it's just a nonsense string.

Marc 1mo ago

Agreed. This makes me want to read a Cypherpunk's Manifesto again. Governments won't need a CBDC if they can just use digital ID's instead.

Laeserin 1mo ago

EU wants a CDBC because the Euro is lagging in usage outside of Europe. They want to compete with the US Dollar and China's Remnibi, both of which are heavily tokenized (through Tether, for instance) and used for international trade.

It would make more strategic sense, to use Bitcoin, but they're so obsessed with their 💶, that it won't happen anytime soon.

Marc 1mo ago

Interesting. I don't know much about the EU. Thanks for the info.

PhⒶntom 1mo ago

Well i got a different theory:

They are well aware about Bitcoin and the Movement happening atm. They are affraid.

Chancellor Merz announcing 1.7 Billion "special funds" at the beginning of the current tyranny is just one of the aspects to watch out for, and all the other "fundings" of ukrain yadda yadda. They know exactly how fiat works, and they dont want Weimar again.

As this happens... people would wake up and rebell. So, you destroy the current Fiat, but only enough to offer the perfect solution to your own "mistake"... called CBDC

They want to reset the game on their own terms

PhⒶntom 1mo ago

The real question is:

Bad intentions or stupidity?

...and I don´t believe in stupidity in these circles

Alex W 1mo ago

i remember hearing about a time when a certain government started tracking and using identity properties and how that turned out..

It was not good. Thats the short version of it.

Marc 1mo ago

Many such stories. I'm not a doomer, but I know a little bit about history.

Alex W 1mo ago

They also want chat control. Which is identifiable on an individual level. 🤷‍♂️

So they might jump through hoops on this one and make it appear you are somehow somewhat better protected regarding privacy in this specific case, but it is just a smokescreen imho. Something they can refer to and say “oh well, at least we are not THAT bad as in UK”, while in fact they are with other things like chat control.

As you can see, I am not particularly optimistic when it comes to governments. Seen too much already, I guess. lol.

Viktor 1mo ago

yea, both roads lead to dystopia.

either they build panopticon via ID-verified-everywhere, or via mandated scanning-of-your-living-room-grade messaging. choose the flavour of chains you prefer.

imo if crypto age tokens are *genuinely* tokenized (zkped out and computed on your own hw), that's way saner than handing every site your driver’s license mid-boner-scroll. and to avoid chat control - use tools built *outside* their sandbox, like Vector - *Privacy by Principle*. DM over NIP-17; no one can enumerate, let alone scan.

but yeah… optimistic? nah. we just move first.

Alex W 1mo ago

I believe the story with chat control was that they would implement it on OS level. So they utilize i.e. apple intelligence to see what you are doing. It will hence encompass everything you do on the device.

But I might be wrong on this. Details are also a bit murky still.

Viktor 1mo ago

"client-side scanning" my dude.

apple/google bake the cop directly into os, so every screen, photo, dm runs local ai to flag "crime", then upload red-flags upstream.

eu drafts already call it "child-safety-hash-alerts".

**no app is immune if the os is the snitch.**

your only hope is open hw + open os (e.g. pixel w/ graphene, pine, etc) + foss apps that refuse the scanner.

Vector works on both so you're not hostaged to bigtech sensors.

brb gonna torch my iphone and buy a pinephone lol

Alex W 1mo ago

lol.

I love how fast you can type. You must have the dexterity of a 10 year old.

But yes, open source is our only hope. We need more platforms than just the big two. Its far too easy to control.

Viktor 1mo ago

lmao caffeine > dexterity. but yea, duopoly = single switch to flip. the more lineage / graphene / sailfish / pinephones in the wild, the harder to herd us. get one, flash it, dm over nip-17. let's ghost the goons.