Nostr Web Client

Payments are so backwards.

The seller, who cannot influence how the buyer pays, have to pay the payment handling fee.

This is unnatural. Nature strives to be sustainable. But if the person decides how to pay, who is not influenced by the payment method/costs, how will it every be efficient?

I think this is done for profit maximalization. People will pay with the most convenient method, until all methods cost the same for them. So if you make the most comfortable method the most expensive, you make huge profits.

But then, why would a payment alternative arise, if this method maximizes profit for payment handling?

Easy.

Market share.

If you make a payment method, that is cheaper, and people start to use it, you will drive them out from competition.

Then, why would people change to a different payment method, if for them it costs more?

I think this change has to be driven by merchants, because they are the "victims". They have to pay something they shouldn't have to otherwise.

And they could drive adoption, by giving a cashback for those who use their new favourite payment method. And if the new payment method is cheaper, they can still earn the same money, but drive adoption.

#grownostr #plebchain #idea

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Discussion

NaturalNerd 1y ago

I see places, mostly resturants, that charge the customer for using credit cards.

I agree this seems backwards

Crusty 👨‍💻 1y ago

You mean, charging for credit card payment seem backwards?

Sacred Peak 1y ago

he's talking about the place adding and extra fee of a person uses a credit card

Crusty 👨‍💻 1y ago

Why shall the merchant pay the fees?

Sacred Peak 1y ago

they don't pay the fees.

this is the same as corporate tax. retailers bake the credit card % fees in to their prices. it's always the consumer who pays tax, never corporations or retailers.

The Gap, etc. all the prices contain that fee in them, it's just not broken down nor do they want it broken down otherwise consumers would see it.

it's all mirrors

Crusty 👨‍💻 1y ago

Then what would be the difference from a consumer perspective between:

1️⃣ All payment methods has no fees

2️⃣ Each payment method has an associated different fee

Sacred Peak 1y ago

if there is actually no fee there is no fee

if there's a hidden fee it's a few we don't see

if it's a fee that is displayed it's a fee we are aware of

Crusty 👨‍💻 1y ago

I believe in transparency.

If you want to accept credit / debit card payments, you have to pay 3 different type of fees. Plus you get your money late, and also the chargebacks. Kind of pain.

If you want to accept cash. It is free to accept.

Then if you want to accept credit cards, you have to increase your prices to include credit card accepting cost.

I think, it would be much more transparent and logical, that whoever uses a payment method it shall bear the cost of it.

This means, you can pay by cash paying no extra cost, or by card paying for comfort.

Then it is transparent, how much these cost. Plus too expensive payment methods would be driven out of markets by consumers.

Maybe I am wrong.

Sacred Peak 1y ago

there isn't a right or a wrong.

we just have effed up broken systems . it doesn't cost Visa any more to process a $500 purchase than a $5 purchase. I expect it's under a dollar to process if there even is a real cost yet Visa charges a %.

some say it's because they are guaranteeing the money but meh.

we pay a fee when buying BTC and the fee is less or more based on the speed. that seems more reasonable.

i think the players in the way things are now have a vested interest in keeping it the same.

Crusty 👨‍💻 1y ago

Visa, etc definitely, but payment processors at the end don't care. They can add a new method without a hassle.

This is only existential for credit card companies. So they definitely would do anything to survive. But the monopoly they have, and the high fees they charge are ridiculous. This should be challenged at least for fun.

But I see the need for an alternative from merchant side.

Lightning seems good alternative for them: instant, low fee, no chargebacks.

Vs credit cards: at least 3 days, high fees, costly chargebacks.

Also from payer sides, you don't know how much data credit card companies have on you, which is...

Sacred Peak 1y ago

yep

and as always fun to chit chat back and forth with you nostr:nprofile1qqspj28wx4v02n33vnvp6fkrtcfrcf2t4cfgx4xhv97hlkrz6uxe52cppemhxue69uhkummn9ekx7mp0qyg8wumn8ghj7mn0wd68ytnddakj7qgawaehxw309ahx7um5wghx6at5d9h8jampd3kx2apwvdhk6tczc730m

Crusty 👨‍💻 1y ago

With you too nostr:npub16jad3sjdf0hynxhmpzpsuuwazqlxrcq824kjpw3w7wr8ldt3xm0q0zq4nn

Sacred Peak 1y ago

idk if this is still the case but this was always against the Visa ToS and you used to be able to report it

I get if it's a really low $ purchase that the fees are high but....

NaturalNerd 1y ago

Then you could offer a discount for paying with cash

Sacred Peak 1y ago

yes you could, my old tea lady used to discount for cash.

but the point was/is that they weren't allowed to charge more for using the card

what we need is a discount for paying with BTC 😀

Sacred Peak 1y ago

Credit card companies are scammers. From the fees they charge to the minimum payment that locks people into debt and never paying it off.

A family member for into such bad credit card debt that they were kiting card payments between credit cards... using cards to pay other cards in a circle that never ended.

At a shit job I had when I was young, you had to use the store credit card to get the discount. People were working to pay the minimum card payments and unable to pay expenses.

Scary.