The German politicians told German men that Heimat isn't a real thing, Germans should improve the world by dying off, marriage is just a piece of paper, and Germans don't have any culture, anyway.
And now they want German men to fight in their military and the men are like,
Fight for what, tho? 🤔
Not to mention how we've spend literal decades on Außenpolitik/foreign affairs instead of taking a look inwards.
Not much left of it now imho.
Well, they thought destroying nationalism would make people indifferent about their own fates or the well-being of their loved ones, but it seems to mostly have removed a layer and collapsed loyalty down to ethnic groups and individual regions or Länder.
People don't stop wanting to organize with the like-minded and their neighbors, just because you dissolve the borders. They want to organize even harder because they see how useless or even destructive the national government has become.
It's like, they can't even protect the borders.
2015/2016 was quite wild - and a massive political flop.
2020/2021 was very unique - and a desaster.
I see a pattern and I am not sure if I like it. o-o
What we have now is schizophrenic politics:
1) There are no borders, until there is a bad flu and then they seal them within 24 hours.
2) It is impossible to track down and detain violent foreign criminals, but the prisons contain people arrested for wrong-think or for not paying their radio fees.
3) There is no German identity, but we must rush to get everyone a German passport, so that they can identify as German.
4) We need more children, but only if they don't have German parents, and arrive as fully-formed adults.
5) The government solves no problems, but we should pay more taxes.
6) The climate regulations drive windmill and solar panel builders out of the country.
Etc. Etc. Etc.
Germany hasn’t had a good run really, Weimar, Hitler, East/West split, Stasi etc…
You folks did make some very good microphones though… oh and tape and some nice cars.
Middle Europe, in general, has been down on it's luck. Everyone marches through.
Yes. The lack of consistency is really exhausting, but that is intentional:
”In my study of communist societies, I came to the conclusion that the purpose of communist propaganda was not to persuade or convince, not to inform, but to humiliate; and therefore, the less it corresponded to reality the better. When people are forced to remain silent when they are being told the most obvious lies, or even worse when they are forced to repeat the lies themselves, they lose once and for all their sense of probity. To assent to obvious lies is...in some small way to become evil oneself. One's standing to resist anything is thus eroded, and even destroyed. A society of emasculated liars is easy to control. I think if you examine political correctness, it has the same effect and is intended to.
Theodore Dalrymple”
Fascinating
Hmmm. I’m seeing a pattern here. Seems like this is the story with a lot of governments. Hmmm.
No, it must be my imagination.
That is absolutely on point!!
A nation state is defined by the borders it controls. There is simply no point to a nation state without borders, and I think everyone now knows that, regardless of whether they are happy or sad about it.
The main political differentiation now is mostly
Yay, nation state gone! ☺️
Nooo, nation state gone! 😢
Everything else is just noise.
Borders are just lines on a map, why shouldn't people move freely across them?
Why don't you go test that theory somewhere that real ones still exist...
What you are really arguing for is that you can travel where you want but others should be restricted based on some arbitrary criteria.
I'm arguing for property rights being respected.
I don't have to justify to anyone why some particular person shall not be allowed on my property. The same rule goes for communally-held property.
Trespass at your own risk.
When people travel to different countries, the don't violate property rights.
The literally do. A border is just some entity's property line.
Whose exactly? A country is just a name for a place on a map with lines squiggled around it. No property rights are broken crossing them. A country isn't the same as private property. People have a god given right to travel the realm freely.
It belongs to the one willing to defend it, like all property. That is usually whoever is already in possession of it.
Property rights trump freedom of movement.
Funny how many animal species understand & yet so many humans seem not to... 🤣
Right to travel does not equate to right to be accepted by the locals. Down to them refusing to sell you land and refusing to sell you building materials and food if one of their number does sell you land. In the absence of laws regulating discrimination that would happen some places.
Sincerely a local from a part of the world where if you moved here tomorrow your descendants might be considered locals in 100 years. Maybe.
I am not arguing that it is. So you agree we all should have equal right to travel across borders unhindered?
Nope. I'm from Texas.
We shoot trespassers first and ask questions, later.
I guess. Good luck to you if the people whose border you want to cross don’t want you there and you decide to fight it out with them. Hope it works out ok for you. Not that it’s my business one way or the other. Unless you’re talking about where I’m from and then if I’m forced to pick a side it won’t be on theoretical principles. It will be based on who I’m related to. Whether that’s an illegal immigrant from another country or a legal one from New York, Ohio or Pennsylvania.
Also in the absence of government owned “public” property there would be places that would have no “public” property and right to travel might be restricted just to people from the area by the ownership instead of open to all. I guess that’s the real question. Is any government ownership of property legitimate given there funding mechanisms or is it all ill gotten gains from criminal activity. Speaking of taxes. While education is one of the biggest line items at the state and local levels it’s not immediately clear to me why people should have the right to move into an area en masse and necessitate all sorts of previously unneeded infrastructure. Including maintenance and staffing of the infrastructure. Especially if they immediately get the vote and can start voting to raise the taxes of people whose families have been paying in to build and then maintain what was previously enough infrastructure for the population.
Paying in for generations I mean. I went to elementary school in the same building my grandparents did. Now there’s a dozen new schools in the county and property taxes are higher than ever. That’s all from legal immigrants. I wonder how many new teachers that is. Yeah people moving here en masse is great.
Now you are talking, freedom of movement and government theft and social welfare are separate things. Hence why we need plan B.
Why should someone be denied crossing a border because someone doesn't like them? Isn't that bigoted? Passports haven't even been around for a 100 years, there's no such thing as an illegal immigrant. That statist communist speak.
Are we talking setting up shop in an existing community or starting a new community in the boonies? Its unrealistic to expect people to not react in certain ways to their community being changed without their input. And it will change. If for no other reason that more people means more problems simply in terms of needed infrastructure and the fact that a certain number of people just aren’t going to get on board with societal norms for whatever reason.
I'm talking if someone packs up, moves to your town, rents a house, looks for work etc.. why is it a problem? Regardless where they are from?
Again, you are assuming anyone needs to answer to you. They don't need a "good" reason to protect their own land.
It's just a discussion, no one says you need a good reason to protect your land. But that's not what you are doing. You are saying people shouldn't be allowed to cross borders and move freely if they like, only you can.
Only the people who own the land have the right to cross the land. Everyone else has to ask for permission and their request may be rejected for any reason.
This does not change, merely because the people who own the land are a group.
Using the same logic, I can choose not to recognise your ownership of the land.
Yes, so come and take it.
Property rights don't need to be recognised to exist. That is why they are natural rights.
Individually? It’s not. When you’re talking about doubling, or more, the population over the course of 20 years it becomes a problem. That person should also accept that they aren’t a part of the community in the way that someone from there is and they need to accept being treated differently by people until they assimilate which might take a few years, a few decades or a few generations.
I’m not even saying they need to be forced out. Just don’t expect people to like their community changing or be nice and accepting of the people doing the changing. I would be down with anyone trying to force that acceptance being forced out.
Especially if you move to small town/rural area and not a city that already had 100,000 people in it.
There are usually natural limits such as housing and number of jobs.
They can just terrify the locals and take their houses, when they move away. That's the usual path.
Tell that to the people who are coming in and putting in 1000s of houses every year. In the county I live in I mean. Hell the mayor in one of the small towns near me is *bragging* about getting ready to double the population in a 5 year period.
Why shouldn’t the locals feel a certain way about that? The ones that aren’t getting kick backs from land developers I mean.
People have the right to be bigoted. I'm not the thought police.
Their property, their business. Their home, their castle.
The Open Borders movement is a branch off of the Communist International and a step toward One World Government.
Don't need borders, if the UN and the WEF rule everyone, everywhere.
Every country is already under control of the communist cabal and people were free to travel in the past, whats changed?
Transportion became much cheaper and more efficient, through things like automobiles, large steel ships, and air flight, so people started arriving in larger numbers from further away.
Yes, and the first thing they did was give us the EU and dissolve the internal borders. That's how they roll.
Ethnic property rights are a brake on international communism. And always have been.
Real borders always were ethnic, which is why everything turned to shit when the British started redrawing them... 😂
Then the US did it.
I would never fight for them … the only reason to fight is for family and friends! 🫂💜
With Germany's terrible war records, I'm a bit leary about them fighting on the same side this time...
I think it’s a good idea start to offer Jews land in Germany instead of having the Palestinians be ethnically cleansed
A lot of people in Israel are German citizens and can return at any time.
But they might not want to come back because Germany has now imported a lot of angry Palestinians.
Thanks to Germans
You forgot the "very".
They are _very_ angry palestinians. And, may I add, they have a very strong point there.
Maybe. Still don't want them around.
Nothing dumber than importing BOTH SIDES from foreign wars.
We keep doing that. That's why the Eritrean street fights happen, for instance.
Germany and the EU should stop fucking with Africa.
That’s a good start to slowing down and one day ending the movements
It would take about five minutes and cost €0 to slow and eventually reverse the movement.
As we have seen.
I’m sure huge Cost savings but for sure they’re pissing away any savings on funding other crimes against humanity
You're trying to link two disparate things and I'm not having it. We don't have to solve for world peace and export feminist foreign policy to Namibia, prior to closing the border to mass immigration.
We can just close it, right this minute, and then consider what to do next.
If anything, importing people from all of these different countries has just forced Germany to meddle in the politics from all of the sending countries, to reduce the flow of immigrants by "solving the problems in the sending countries".
The immigrants come in, the diplomats and soldiers go out.
Also, the idea that people from a crappy neighborhood wouldn't prefer to live in a much better neighborhood, is unrealistic. Europe is already much better because of the climate and vegetation and public infrastructure.
If you let them come here, they will continue to come, so long as their home country isn't better.
Had some in town a few months ago.
Policemen were like "tf why" XD
We be like,
Oh, no! Those people from Whateverland are fighting for decades, absolutely despise each other and blame us for all of their problems, and now a huge war has broken out. 😱
Let's move them all to Germany, so that they can fight in more comfortable surroundings, have 30 days paid vacation, and scream at us at closer range. ☺️
I’d there’s a god
He would say that’s a good thing to do
Fight for western values aka the profits of the oligarchs
Same thing happening in the US and the entire western world. At least if you're any lighter skinned than a tanned Mediterranean sailor.
What's worse is that it's half true. Our culture was robbed from most of us by the government schools.
It's been particularly surreal for me, having been raised as a black girl, to grow up and have people yelling at me that I'm LITERALLY HITLER because I don't hate German people hard enough. 😄
Like they turned the brown paper bag test 180°.
There’s a beautiful book called Heimat by Nora Krug. It’s a comic,but with a very touching history of belonging and identity. I think you might like it. Give it a try. 😘
And why only men and not alle 60 genders?
And when the germans will go on the streets to stop this way into destruction?
Because they'd have to change the Basic Law for that and there's no majority for that change.
