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This is the current situation.

- You buy something with Bitcoin:

In most countries you have to pay vat and in addition capital gains between the difference of buying and selling Bitcoin if you have made a profit.

This is an approximate 20% + 20% (of the profit) (It depends on each country).

- You sell Bitcoin:

You pay between 20% and 30% of the profit (Depending on country).

You have a lot of Bitcoin:

In some countries you will pay wealth tax.

You have a lot of unrealized gains:

In many countries they are trying to apply this, soon we will have the first country to do so.

If you have bought bitcoin with KYC you are screwed, the exchanges will end up passing all the data to the states and their respective tax offices.

If you have non-kyc bitcoin you can only use it to buy a soda, if you use it to buy a car or a house they will accuse you of money laundering, drug trafficking or whatever they want.

And you think bitcoiners have won? You can go to a country that has more lax tax regulations but tax havens are becoming increasingly difficult.

You have to try to make Bitcoin legal tender, and to do this you have to use your Bitcoin, and you have to accept Bitcoin as payment, only by creating a large black market where you do not have to pay taxes you can bend the state, otherwise your Bitcoin will only enrich the state.

During all these years the HODL strategy has been totally wrong, while we have carried out HODL the states have encircled us.

We came here for freedom.

OgFOMK ArTS 1y ago 💬 1

I like this take.

It also makes me think that the inferior money the US federal government spends on IRS agents, infrastructure and records could easily by shifted into mining Bitcoin and the return on investment would outpace all the nonsense of imprisonment, violence, garnishment and tax filing. Seriously, why not mine Bitcoin and run lightning nodes?

I'm sure the agents would rather be tech minded miners, node runners and Bitcoin gurus. It's amazing and it's sad that they are dying and yet they keep hitting the stimulation button for their fix of power.

Utility companies, City, county, state and Fed governments could even get rid of big data wearhouses by putting the miners in people's businesses and homes. Providing a real service of data, power and shared income.

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Discussion

Cyph3rp9nk 1y ago 💬 1

You have touched on a very interesting topic, why don't they do it even though it would be very profitable and maybe even more so than what they do now?

For the same reason we pay taxes even though they can print and borrow as much money as they want.

It is all about power, for power to exist the weak must exist and the weak must be subdued so that they cannot become strong.

TheGrinder 1y ago 💬 2

But what if you decided not to pay taxes like 10 years ago already? Detaching yourself from the tax scams isn't as difficult as it sounds. You just have to want it and then do it.

Cyph3rp9nk 1y ago

It also depends on the country where you live

b799e60f... 1y ago 💬 1

Share these thoughts, please. I would love to read your strategy towards it

TheGrinder 1y ago 💬 1

Once you leave your own country other countries aren't to fussed how you make your money as long as you can pay your rent. But afaik American's for example always get to report back to the IRS even if they leave the USA. Kinda ridiculous that "the land of the free" is charging you money / exit tax when you decide that you had enough.

I've travelled for most of my life and in line with that stopped paying taxes many years ago. On the flip side, I wont get a pension so that's the trade-off you have to expect.

b799e60f... 1y ago 💬 1

Makes sense. I’m moving towards becoming a nomad than simply staying put. The fact that I won’t get a pension does little to nothing in my future, thank God (I wouldn’t want to be paid in fiat anyway). There are some countries you can stay there longer and not pay any taxes legally. My biggest personal issue is that I would like to make roots in a place, you know?

What do you think of this? Like, having roots in one place, family, kids. How is it for you?

TheGrinder 1y ago 💬 1

I wasn't blessed with children when I was still younger and right now I have no family plans. This could change I guess but the "family planning phase" is somewhat over for me. Though I would say that I did put down my roots during my time in Spain. For me that's not just about forming a family but also about integration, learning the language and having local friends rather than hiding in your ex-pats community.

I wish you good luck on your endeavors!

b799e60f... 1y ago 💬 1

Lucky for us men we can start families late in life. Not even Jesus was considered a man before the age of 30. I have uncles that started their families at 45-48. Don’t give up, push your bloodline forward if you wish to be a dad.

I wish you all the good luck in this world and be blessed.

TheGrinder 1y ago

Yes we can. Doesn't mean we have to force it. I'll either meet the right woman to have a kid (or kids) with or I wont.