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#bitcoin frees us from IDs.

Companies we do business with, while using fiat, need truthful information about us. Names, addresses, account numbers or cards - it all has to be accurate or no business can occur.

That's because fiat is a pull-payment system. You give vendor your ID, they message your bank with your ID, some (tbh very superficial) form of authorization happens, and a payment is pulled from your account. Or the bank pushes after a lot of pulling.

Bitcoin pushes payments and skips all that junk. So why would anyone need your ID in a bitcoinized world?

This means you can choose your own level of privacy. There's no set minimum or maximum for privacy in the techy bitcoinized future. You choose how much you want to reveal. If you choose, privacy can now fully close the gap to full anonymity, and you don't sacrifice any security.

All because bitcoin is a push payment system.

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Discussion

freemymind 🇨🇭 1y ago

Can. But in general when you pay google in bitcoin, Google knows whicht wallets is yours. When they know this they know all your past and future transaction in and out from this wallet is yours. Privacy with Bitcoin is much worse then with the current banking.

With lots of investment, privacy can be possible with Bitcoin. But it is really difficult in practice.

Comte de Sats Germain 1y ago

No investment needed. Nothing needed, other than using btc and not giving your name or details to anyone. Their ability to link addresses to identity will atrophy until it disapeears entirely. Our system doesn't need to change - we just pull ourselves out of their system.

Abstract Equilibrium 1y ago

"Not giving your..details to anyone" is pretty fucking hard. I think it's absurd to think "their abilities" will diminish over time. Trust me, they have the higher ground.

Comte de Sats Germain 1y ago

You're thinking in the current paradigm. I don't blame you - its hard thinking outside of it.

When businesses don't need your ID, they won't want it. Having your ID invites legal trouble and compliance costs.

Getting businesses to accept btc is *more important* than winning KYC. Obviously, don't kyc yourself. But in the long run, it won't matter. I'm talking about society, not your individual safety - privacy is safety, so don't kyc.

freemymind 🇨🇭 1y ago

You as a person have always a physical location. This track of where you are is completely unique. When you buy anything in a physical shop, anyone with internet access knows you have been in this shop, when the transaction was made.

When you buy something online, you have to send them your adress or a pickup place and you have to get there physically.

It is crazy hard to achieve anonymity with Bitcoin. One single leakege and your wallet is burnt. And no one will tell you when it is burnt. With AI correlations with camera footage, transaction patterns and so on will not make it hard to identify you out of every citizen in the world.

Comte de Sats Germain 1y ago

I'm not saying we don't need to improve our privacy in the real world. It would be very nice if there was a way to have things delivered to addresses that we can access but don't have names attached. There are services for that in the US, but I see you have a Switzerland flag in your name, and I don't know what options are available there.

Look into it. Maybe it exists there. If not, think about how you can build it.

Here's one idea - I'm pretty enamored with the potential uses of TOTP tokens. Users of the anonymous mail-receiving service can download a totp token to their phone, which outputs a number every few seconds. The business owner has a file saved that corresponds to your token, so they see the same number output on the same timer. Use that as ID when picking up your item. Just an idea - there may be flaws, but my point is, it can be built, with current tech, and all that's needed is an entrepreneur to do it.

On another note... Please don't be offended. You seem very defeated. Every time we've talked, you only voiced opinions that things are bad or can't be done. You're in Plato's cave. Come out of it!

freemymind 🇨🇭 1y ago

I do not feel offended. But very nice from you to consider that it could be. Concepts like privacy are nothing personal to me.

And yes might better solutions can come up. But one still has to get around physically. And every physical object can be traced. My point is only, that getting full privacy is a huge amount of work, which no one achieves by the way. And Bitcoin is rather weakening privacy compared to current banking and cash then strengthening it. Physical cash will probably always be the most private payment asset one can use.

Comte de Sats Germain 1y ago

Btc can be physical cash if you want it to be.

Perfect anonymity isn't necessarily a good thing. A reasonable level of privacy makes sense, but crimes do occur. Investigative work should have to deal with the costs imposed by privacy, without the slippery slope of perfect transparency.

freemymind 🇨🇭 1y ago

Now you go away from you point without admitting, that Bitcoin is no privacy improvement. You could at least be fair and admit this instead of just switching topic, when you are lost. I am greatful for fair discussions.

This discussion just lost its sense.

Comte de Sats Germain 1y ago

Think of it as an observation, rather than an argument.

Privacy will always depend on your own choices. Bitcoin, IMO, gives us options. Simply being a push payment system dramatically widens the potential for optionality.

I'm not winning points... There's no winner. I'm in awe of something awesome, and expressing that.

Abstract Equilibrium 1y ago

You're not seeing the full spread of threats. Going non-KYC is the tip of the iceberg. It's like putting socks on your feet.. during a hurricane.

Comte de Sats Germain 1y ago

Okay, see my reply to the other lost and defeated nihilist

Abstract Equilibrium 1y ago

It isn't nihilism and there can be no defeat since the game never ends, but I can definitely see the scoreboard. It's simply easier today to surveil than to hide.