right, these are like creating a configuration for sign that says “no dumping over X lbs” but people come around at night and do it anyway since its just a sign and its not enforceable.
Discussion
Well it's a mempool policy... Specifically MY mempool policy. Other people (including miners) can run any policy they want as long as all the txs are in consensus. I like my mempool to include any tx that may end up in a block, but that's just me (my park?), and it's not just signage, it's the actual limit of the trashcan, but just the one in MY mempool.
yeah but your signage doesn’t matter because it doesn’t stop anything
Why did people lobby so hard to get the 80 byte limit removed in order to make their application work
because there weren’t good tools at the time, but tooling improves
If a limit doesn’t matter, but people want to run software to continue to enforce the limit, why should anyone care?
you can do it but i will continue to explain why its pointless and ineffective at the thing its trying to do. I prefer properly engineered solutions and rational human action so we can all move to a place we want to be.
I run core, I just like the knots people
Agree with you here
Is it also pointless and ineffective to run a node if you aren't building txs? I mean kinda, right? But I still want as many people as possible running nodes.
It’s definitely not pointless. I run a node because it’s the only way to know my balance without a trusted third party.
I prefer liberal mempool policy so i can see any tx to me before it confirms
Same. And I do this in Knots. Which was my point... It's a user preference and a default settings debate, not a Core vs Knots debate.
I don’t want knobs, i want sensible defaults (this is also the damus philosophy)
and core is moving toward more sensible ones. i’ve always been against cores overbearing filter settings, which is why i’m happy to see them getting closer to consensus.
Agree. This is the actual debate. It's not actually a trashcan thing... its a default settings thing. Also, I like knobs AND sensible defaults.
I also think we should remove knobs that don’t do the thing people think it does.
As someone who has been running a node since 2010 i have had almost no reason to tweak the data carrier size, as it’s completely inconsequential to anything i would ever care about
I know me changing this has zero effect on the data that actually gets into a block, so who cares other than a small fluctuation in memory use?
Must you impose your preferred policy on everyone else? Or is there room for others to choose their own policy?
customizing policy is a very niche thing imo, like if you have a memory constrained system or something. By all means you can tweak the knobs if you want, but i will continue to point out how pointless it is
YES!!! This is how both parties win.
One side keeps the option to customize.
The other side points out how pointless it is.
My actual thoughts on Bitcoin controversies. Use the tools.
nostr:naddr1qqxnzde5xcurqd3nxsenjwp4qgsryzfwcx393j0jcydf5ka48vf8egsfg8ccq0wh7ec4q58l360azwsrqsqqqa28p27jfn
Very good point, i suspect many people throwing themselves into these debates don’t even run nodes or understand what any of the settings on their node does
What about the argument that "99% of the OP_RETURN txns were/are <= 80bytes"?
That's a common talking point Knots folks bring up. Has any Core supporter put forth the data to refute that?
Could there possibly be any unforeseen consequences to this change?
Consequences are low here... its not like we are removing knobs from an airplane that could crash and kill innocent people if turned the wrong way. Lots of people (thousands at least) understand what these knobs do... why shouldn't we be able to turn them?
you can but it will have no real effect on your node or what gets in a block, so it just seems like dead code to me which is a maintenance burden. We should be moving toward a simpler and streamlined node over time.
I am much more excited for multiprocess for this reason. A lot more flexibility when it comes to attaching different frontends to a daemon. It’s crazy to me that people are talking about this useless knob vs actually useful things
lol yes, this is a pretty pointless debate in all honesty. obviously its a debate about principles, which it why everyone got so passionate about it IMHO.
This is the part the core sycophants don’t understand. People don’t like having functionality stripped away - especially to support bad actors. And the fee incentive is already there to not use op return so the sophisticated actors won’t anyway. Now the rationale is “maintenance burden”. 🤣 GTFO
If core can push through this pointless (in their own words) change without support then why couldn’t they push through other more malicious changes? THAT is the issue and THAT is the debate. People don’t feel like core can be trusted any longer.
So your argument is that knots does not prevent spam, and your solution is that everyone should just allow spam?
That's what this boils down to as far as I can tell.
What I want to understand is why you think that allowing spam and god knows what else is the solution to a problem caused by spam.
If knots does not work to prevent spam ok, give us a better alternative. Why promote spam?
If someone is dumping full blocks of garbage into their trashcan, my mempool will know about it... That's all a mempool policy can do. I'm not running a fork or something, and I'm certainly not mining any blocks... So it's not up to me to construct blocks with larger or smaller trashcans.
right so the garbage comes in 10 minutes later regardless of your mempool. What was the point of the setting again?
What's the point of running a node? It's the same reason. That's why I set the OP_RETURN limit to 3985000, if it's an in consensus tx, I want it in my mempool, so I can easily validate future confirmed txs. (I also allow less than 1 sat/vbyte tx in MY mempool)
minrelaytxfee= 0.000002
"the no raping signs at the park did not prevent violent assaults against women so we should just legalise raping"
Oh no someone tried to break the rules so we should just remove the rules.