Paragraph I and III are in direct conflict here. I sympathize with the predicament, it is a problem that can likely only be solved by leaving the arena for a more inclusive view.

Yes, I believe humans have absolute free will and complete culpability for the outcomes of their decisions in spite of the intentions. Having come from an abusive nuclear family, I know how destructive good intentions and “love” can be. A megalomaniac mother only wants the best for her child, but the intent doesn’t change the experience for the child. Paragraph one is a prime example of destructive love. Do you care for the beggar? Really? Or do you care more about copping a superior attitude while you lecture the beggar about his self destructive choices? Walk a mile in his shoes, and even if you find the behavior unjustified, learn to be quiet and accommodate a human in need without judgement.

Yes, soldiers get a pass from us, but how does that matter on the deity stage? Who are we to excuse behavior on god’s behalf? Because we deem it justified, thou shall not kill doesn’t matter any more to god? Did Jesus hand down some special clause about justified killing? I’m not being facetious here, just asking legitimate questions.

I would go, but on a different flight! If I still crash like in the dream, c’est la vie!

Well, the Bible says in rough paraphrasing that all that is good comes from god. If we’re going to wrestle with these concepts in that box, we better follow the rules of engagement, lack of good in a dichotomy would be nothing, the antithesis of good is nothing if we are going to give Lucifer a fair shake here…it follows that evil has to come from Satan, because Satans’s influence is the opposite of God’s influence. No? Happy thanksgiving btw! 🦃 I’m not sure you’re American, so no insinuation intended!

Evil implies a root causation beyond the control of the person. I ask you, where does evil always come from in your methodological understanding? To use evil as an emphasized form of bad behavior is common and effective, but to adopt evil as some possessive ether from satan is stepping into a box of religious dichotomies I don’t believe exist in the natural environment, conscious or physical that we exist in.

What a perfect example of the change of outcome based on context and intention. Let’s modify the situation to be that you see a beggar smoking and give him a pack of cigarettes. There is no doubt that the outcome will be damage to the recipient’s lungs, and also the temporary cessation of the symptoms of addiction to cigarettes. The same act is kindness if intended to alleviate the pain of withdrawal, and cruelty if intended to provide a means of progression toward the awful symptoms associated with dying of emphysema.

Regarding killing in self defense, the death should always be an unintended consequence of stopping dire personal harm, but I do believe that for many many reasons, some of them treatable mental illness, but unfortunately untreated, there are humans who will harm you and must be prevented from doing so. I have experienced farm animals made mean by abuse that had the will to harm. This doesn’t make them evil, it simply makes them damaged biological machines that don’t function properly in a communal environment, exceptionally similar to human suffering mental illness that makes them dysfunctional in a cooperative community, but a contender in a wilderness survival scenario. To apply a holy vs evil dichotomy to these scenarios is to delegitimize context no? Are all soldiers who have killed in combat guilty of murder?

Regarding the violence question, I cannot think of any animal on earth that when needs are met, are violent. Humans can conceptualize and realize needs that exceed those rationalized by animals lacking our cognitive abilities, and therefore experience scarcity based on expectations rather than physiological need. I do think that scarcity of resources is always the motivation for violence, even if that scarcity is psychological scarring from childhood abuse eg. Persistent lack of nurturing emotional input due to childhood emotional abuse.

Yes, I deem killing in self defense as a necessary event, though even under distress I shoot to stop the behavior, if death results, that is an unintended consequence. Is there ever justification for premeditated murder IYO?

So probably you would say animals are incapable of committing moral evil, but more interesting is whether humans can commit “natural evil”. For the sake of conversation I will embrace the idea of evil, though I disagree with the fundamental premise of evil; to me there only exists good or beneficial, and bad or detrimental behavior toward others, and the associated motivations for those actions, which frequently do not align with the outcome. The concept itself is highly dependent on perceptive context. Thanks for linking the conversation Michael.

It’s cool. It’s a dichotomy box. We’re all stuck in a few of them at any given time. The world is however, in my experience a spectrum. Man generally has spent an enormous amount of time and energy trying to manufacture dichotomies out of spectra and they never fit properly. Even light and dark don’t qualify as a dichotomy in the natural world. Look around….tell me what you see.

Oh man, don’t get me started. lol. 💯

Did you forget omnipotent? lol. 😁

Good vs bad, evil vs holy, but good doesn’t mean holy as bad doesn’t mean evil. I think it’s an important distinction.

I think the word good has been hijacked to be synonymous with holy. Good and bad are antonyms, while evil and holy are antonyms. It’s a nuance that I’m sensitive to, probably unnecessarily. 😊

From an initial position of faith in Christianity proctored by my parents from the dawn of my consciousness. The journey out of blind faith is a long and storied one that took twenty six years. I’m happy to share if you’re interested. I may say things in sharing that could perhaps destabilize your faith, and I understand the function and legitimacy of religion in people’s lives so if you would rather not have the conversation I understand.

How do you define evil?

I think there are people who commit immoral acts, and do bad things for a variety of reasons, but the concept of evil suggests some force acting outside of the realm of the person’s control. It’s the same as blessings, I don’t believe one person can be blessed any more or less than anybody else.

There is no such thing as evil? It’s a religious construct.

With respect for your views, I disagree. I believe belief in gods was perhaps the first pervasive successful deception on humankind.

This is one of the major problems with meat production too. It all needs to be processed in a USDA facility, at enormous cost, facilities that individuals can’t possibly afford. Similar with dairy processing facilities.

It’s the lawsuits that concern anyone with something to lose in real assets. Raw milk has to be dead drop exchanged like schedule one drugs or moonshine. lol.

Raw milk is unlawful to sell without state oversight in some, most? States.