Today I learned a lot about Lightning. For example, if you have very old LND channels, it's possible that they won't be of the ANCHOR channel type. These cannot be CPFP fee bumped. It's also possible that older CLN channels are this way too. I have 43 channels and 4 of them are of the STATIC_REMOTE_KEY type. Those 4, if they get force closed, cannot be fee bumped.

My bad luck left me a channel with a lot of sats on my end, of a channel that was remotely opened to me and a non ANCHOR channel. Essentially the worst combination.

This left me with a pending transaction of 1 sat/vbyte. It could take 6 months for the mempool to almost clear again. But, there's also a chance that my transaction never gets through too. Especially with the upcoming bull run next year, we just don't know what it's going to be like.

So, what does a Nostrich do in this situation. Well, for starters, I got annoyed and freaked out. I then spent two days trying to resolve this.

And then I paid F2Pool 147K sats for them to include my transaction in an upcoming block. That may seem like a lot, but I had 6.5M sats on the line here. That's an incredible amount of Bitcoin to me. This gives me peace of mind.

To prevent this from happening, I'm probably going to close the other 3 channels that I have open that are not ANCHOR channels so that this does not happen again. I'll reopen what I can when I can.

At least I can now go to bed a happy Nostrich.

Goodnight!

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#KnowledgeIsPower

nostr:note1q7cxdvku4nc9fmfd49wtttww9sy6hfhacluw2jeal67zya270v6ssl65zc

Thanks for sharing

Hopefully my headache helps someone else at some point.

Oh wow gonna have to check my channels now.

lncli listchannels

Look for "commitment_type"

Good night😴

sleep well, what an adventure

Lightning: How to lose money, make friends and learn a ton along the way !!

Holy shit. How do I find out if I have ANCHOR channels?

In command line use command listchannels, it gives you all the data relevant to all channels. Look for "commitment_type": "ANCHORS", If you dont see this then I dont think it is

In umbrel from the umbrel directory put in below command

./scripts/app compose lightning exec lnd lncli listchannels

I created an alias for him. He can use the standard lncli and bitcoin-cli commands without needing to run the standard long Umbrel commands.

I used this to modify my bash rc file so all I have to do is type the actual command after myfunc and I can run any command. I gave him the full command incase he was a newb and didn’t know. Is there another way to run the commands by typing just the command and not preceding it with myfunc that you know of????

myfunc() {

./scripts/app compose lightning exec lnd lncli "$@"

}

yes, that's what i used to do essentially. edit .bash_aliases and add the following

alias lncli="/home/umbrel/umbrel/scripts/app compose lightning exec lnd lncli"

alias bitcoin-cli="/home/umbrel/umbrel/scripts/app compose bitcoin exec bitcoind bitcoin-cli"

Is a force close both you and your partner's tx? Can either of you bump it? J/w

It was a force close. And no, you cannot bump a force close with feebump. It didn't work for me and Alex Bosworth informed me why.

USE ANCHOR OUTPUTS CHANNELS WHENEVER POSSIBLE

Every transaction off-chain is a valid, signed unpublished Bitcoin transaction called a “commitment transaction”. These transactions can be broadcast on-chain if one party decides to close the channel unilaterally. This is known as a “force close” transaction.

Since the broadcast of a commitment transaction can occur at any point, it’s impossible to estimate how much fee the transaction should pay accurately. If you pay a too-low fee rate, the commitment transaction may not get confirmed in time. As a result, any timelocks inside it could expire, and funds can be stolen.

This is where anchor outputs can help. These outputs can be attached to commitment transactions to allow either channel participant to bump the transaction fee. You should consider opening anchor output channels whenever possible.

In LND, check that protocol.no-anchors is not enabled on your configuration file. This will force all of your lightning channels to be anchor output channels. Without this channel type, you cannot increase the fee of a force close. But remember that LND will require 1 UTXO to be reserved for every anchor channel.

This problem and many others is why I think we're going to have to suspend #Bitcoin #transaction #fees indefinitely.

I'm not sure they were ever a good idea for Bitcoin or virtuous #fullnodes..🫤

🧐

Thanks for bring this up. Very helpful. 🤙

nostr:npub18ams6ewn5aj2n3wt2qawzglx9mr4nzksxhvrdc4gzrecw7n5tvjqctp424 more on the anchor commitment type

I listed all my channels in command line and looked at all my channels

I have two that are not set, BCash_Is_Trash and Bitcoin Jungle, These are not old channels so I wonder if it’s actually those channels doing something on their side.Below the top two Ines are what you see if it has no anchor and the below two are what you if anchor is set. So it appears its the static remote key

"static_remote_key": true,

"commitment_type": "STATIC_REMOTE_KEY",

"static_remote_key": false,

"commitment_type": "ANCHORS"

Yes, those are the commands that I ran and yes, similarly, both of my channels with those two nodes were static remote key as well. My Bitcoin Jungle channel is only 6 months old. I opened the channel to Bitcoin Jungle, so I'm extra curious there.

Seems one of two options. Either those channels have for some reason set the flag for static to true for some reason or they have not updated thier node software for quite sometime.

Maybe that's it. They're running old LND versions? We can ask nostr:npub1taycl7qfuqk9dp0rhkse8lxhz3az9eanjug8j4ympwehvslnetxqkujg5y 🤙🏻

You did essentially the same thing as a CPFP with the F2Pool side fee. That’s fascinating. I’m glad you were able to resolve it, and that there’s a free market solution to this problem at all

Are you pruning Ordinals? It's around 26K. Been that way the past two days.

And yes, I could have waited, but for me, waiting and not having access to this Bitcoin with the chance of never having access to it was greater than paying a fee. I'm okay with this.

Oops wrong person to reply to. Yawn. Sorry.