Shit is about to get dystopian af, and if they know your stack you better believe they're are gonna fuck with you.
You down to fuck bro?
Discussion
Lost them all in a boating accident
Now come confiscate the 12 words in my brain
They'll start confiscating things that they can confiscate to the value of what they believe they are owed.
They have the value, you gave it to them.
I guess 99% of all Bitcoiners will have a big problem then
This is the practical response. The most-likely outcome is that it is impossible (due to costs) to enforce any KYC-related regulations.
NGU is incredibly important to make that cost as significant as possible.
So what’s your view?
I think KYC is “out of the bag” and by bitcoin acting as a sound money, it renders flaccid many the anti-KYC crowd’s concerns.
Would it be awesome if exchanges didn’t have KYC as a requirement, sure. But they do. And those exchanges are the best way for people in Western economies to acquire real sats and self-custody them.
Short of becoming entirely authoritarian and totalitarian in the physical world, governments won’t really have recourse. And if bitcoin moons in price then it becomes prohibitively expensive for them to administer regulations because the market will be demanding bitcoin over dollars.
Well put! Thanks for sharing 🙏🏼
So what aboit the famous „lost my keys“ argument? 🤔
Again, they'll just put you in jail or take shit that they can take.
They know and can proove you have/had corn.
They will take their cut from you.
Then it's just war anyway.
The boating accident meme originated from 2017. Some drug dealer said he kept his keys in a fishing pole he lost.
Just be careful what you wish for
These people are not sane or reasonable
History is filled with examples of a mob violating the rights of individuals
Understood. And again I’m not against it and I can definitely see the value of it
To all of you holding non KYC sats I have a question. What if some day you’re in a very bad situation in which you have to sell bitcoin for fiat in order to survive (let’s say you get sick and need to sell for your treatment). How will you do that with non KYC sats? Let’s say it’s a very big amount. You’ll most likely never be able to convert that to fiat without governments raising questions where it came from.
Good question.
Is Bitcoin fungible or isn't it?
It is to me, but it’s all subjective. Is gold fungible? Depends who you’re selling it to.
Still wondering how you would cash out non kyc sats without being marked as criminal or illegal money by the bank
Hardened Bitcoiners will tell you that there is no returning to fiat. In practice it would depend on your size, timeframe, and regulatory environment.
Most of the time the state isn’t actually interested in putting you in jail - they just want to steal your money. If you’re prepared to declare a reasonable cost basis and pay their extortion taxes I don’t think you’ll have a problem, at least in the western world.
The dream of Bitcoin is still peer to peer money. I understand that scaling and security changes this a bit, but anyone who is already here and has stacked for a while will always be able to afford to make Bitcoin transactions. Pay directly in Bitcoin when possible.
There is nothing special about KYC sats that will force people to accept them or not. A bank today still wouldn’t trade you fiat for your KYC Bitcoin. The most realistic plan would be to use a foreign exchange and trade for stablecoins, if you’re not able to use a regular KYC one.
In places with high inflation and really bad capital controls, there are local money markets where people make a living out of doing illegal currency swaps. I could see that becoming a bigger thing here if things continue in the direction they’ve gone.
My final point (long rant my bad) is that this topic gets to the heart of the entire social issue. We need people to understand why this is all important, and unfortunately 90%+ of people currently don’t care, are distracted, or are so unhealthy physically and mentally that they cannot break free. We will never get to hyperbitcoinization without the broad culture shifting, whether that be bottom up or top down. For now, the nature of most people leads them to value compliance, fitting in, and listening to authority more than freedom, thinking for yourself, and prosperity. And there’s no difference between KYC or non-KYC Bitcoin when it comes to that problem. Both entail risk.
Thanks!! Love reading your long rant!
This is exactly why I love Nostr
Just honest and real conversations
You can always KYC your sats, but it’s much harder to un-KYC them.
50% of Bitcoin was mined before 2012, before there was rampant KYC. I think the risks of revealing non-KYC Bitcoin in a crisis are lower than having your stack be known to adversaries in a crisis.
But again with that said, I have a lot of KYC sats. I don’t preach about it because I’m already public about my interest in Bitcoin (potentially unwisely) and there are a lot of challenges with stacking non-KYC with regularity.
It’s kind of like not closing the door when you shit at home - 99% of the time it doesn’t make a difference, but there are situations where you’ll be caught with your pants down.
Hahaha great comparison
No seriously I get all your points. All of you. Thank you for all these arguments. I’m glad we at least can have an open discussion about it
Buy a watch, car, or other expensive item with my stack.
Sell it for fiat.
Sometimes think the hardest core, only non-KYC maxis are inadvertently empowering the state by overstating its reach and capacity and deterring 90 percent of people who would acquire some from the simplest way to trade dollars for sats.
Yes, KYC is a scourge, and I’d rather it didn’t exist, but it DOES exist in the places most people have their fiat wealth. Don’t discourage the exit because it’s not perfect.
It is, and they might, but the point of freedom tech is they will have a hard time doing so.
Don’t give the state too much respect. It is not omnipotent.
It is increasingly omnipotent sir.
it's increasingly omniscient, but losing power every day as its fiat purchasing/printing power diminishes into the black hole of value storage, created 15 years ago.