I have seen several very interesting podcast episodes on this topic.
One was from nostr:nprofile1qqs043gn588da502h36q0sffjay9m69mk28dmm805qtgzl7g6n6q0fgpp4mhxue69uhkyunz9e5k7tcpzemhxue69uhk2er9dchxummnw3ezumrpdejz7qgwwaehxw309ahx7uewd3hkctc80655m, the other from the "Chris Fader" podcast on youtube.
