Nostr Web Client

Yet you ask for permission from every relay and server in Nostr, AND you ask permission from ICANN to reach those relays.

That's just a few of the things Pubky does better.

Didn't you notice Primal & Damus trying to charge fees for their services? That is permission. All servers on earth are permissioned. Do you know why?

Valentino Giudice 5mo ago

Were you aware that you can use Nostr without ever interacting with Primal or Damus in any way?

You can even write your own client, if you wish, and use any list of relays among tens of public ones (or run your own).

Centralized DNS is an issue. Some communities are working on that issue (Namecoin, ENS and many others). It's not an issue specific to Nostr.

The only parties that can stop me from using Nostr are the same that can stop me from using pretty much anything else on the Internet: my government (they can arrest me), ICANN and a few other parties.

There is no party whatsoever specific to Nostr that has any power of any sort on me as a Nostr user.

Reply to this note

Please Login to reply.

Discussion

Big Bad John 5mo ago

You are describing the entire web, not Nostr alone.

There is nothing in Nostr's design that makes it more resilient than the web, aside from using keys as identities.

The rest is exactly the same.

You put your data on web servers and hope other people can access and share it.

Relays can censor you, DNS can censor you. Apps can censor you.

So, yes, the web is fully open, and if you host everything yourself, you do have more control.

But Nostr didnt provide that, DNS did. And if you need any other computer on the web to help you find or distribute data, you become censorable again.

Valentino Giudice 5mo ago

No one relay can censor me. There isn't any central party, there isn't any special relay.

Client developers and relay operators are just random asses with a computer. Anyone can use as many relays as they like and whatever app lets them read what they want to (or develop their own).

This is in contrast with mainstream social media. If I go on Twitter and write "cisgender", Elon Musk can shadowban me. If I get on Nostr and say something any specific person you can name doesn't like, none of them, individually, can censor me.

Of course if the whole world agrees to censor me I will be censored.

Using Nostr doesn't make you depend on any specific computer owned by someone else, except those which we'd be using regardless of Nostr (DNS servers, ISPs and so on).

Fiatjaf cannot censor me as his own individual choice. The operator of any specific relay cannot censor me, because I don't depend on any specific relay and no relay plays a central role.

Big Bad John 5mo ago

You ignored everything I said and replied with a bunch of noise.

Just read it again if you want a reply:

nostr:note1jknch3u47706rtpl7wcv4zhaf5cmxwh3y38s0xmhgsdzs6sp893scqaqsr

Garbage nsec 5mo ago

The problem is that almost all of the parties you mention (clients, relays, media servers) are running at a loss, at least without grant funding in the picture.

A good client takes at least one dev to maintain, and that's one dev's fair compensation, with some clients running full teams and a hefty amount of in-house infra on top.

Many relays are running at a pure loss, when you look at infra costs, as well as spam and CSAM mitigation etc. If you add at the cost of incorporation and licensing, which are being almost completely ignored by multiple parts of the system, this only adds to the list.

So in the end what can end up being the censor is simple economic reality. If grant funding stops tomorrow then economics steps in and says "you play by my rules now".

ActivityPub is different because it can actually run on its own financial steam. BitTorrent as well, it has the financials worked out. But Nostr is still at very high risk of being censored by nothing more than the need for humans to pay rent every month.

Valentino Giudice 5mo ago

ActivityPub is not censorship resistant, nor meant to. If your account is registered to an instance and that instance censors you your account is fucked.

Garbage nsec 5mo ago

Sure but Im not talking about resistance to being shut down by an instance admin . Im talking about resistance to being shut down by pure economic reality. In that department at least AP is far ahead of Nostr