I now have a Phoenix ⚡️ wallet.
That was two very expensive moves from my WoS.(fees)
3,000 sats each to creat a channel.
Time to learn more about channels and Phoenix wallet.
Discussion
🤯 god damn I’m assuming it might’ve been cuz of the swap from on chain to off chain
No idea 6k sats gone 😭
The first 3k to “open the channel” I expected to send from my WoS.
I tried a second transaction and it took another 3k… not sure what I did wrong yet
Mmh weird, I’m guessing it’s due to how WoS handles sending sats to Lightning wallets that and the mempool is a freaking mess rn
You needed a new channel to send more sats, when you sent the first set of sats, you created a channel and then all the sats pushed to your side, meaning you had no room for more. When you sent more, you needed another channel to receive them.
If you sent them all from the same place, your mistake was not sending them all at once.
If you’re using pheonix to RECEIVE sats, you will need to spend all your sats to make the liquidity change from outbound to inbound.
If you’re trying to spend from pheonix, you can do that now as your liquidity is all outbound at the moment.
Yes, Phoenix wallet is great!
I know it costs to create the channel but it also cost to move from WoS?
No clue 😭 lol
Was there a big fee?
It was opening a channel. Learning more about what that means.
So I spent 6ksats in total opening 2 channels with WoS
Phoenix is a good Lightning wallet. You should learn about channels. You basically want to create sizable channels to well connected, well maintained nodes.
Pheonix only makes connections to one node, ACINQ.
Can you elaborate on this a bit? For instance, my Phoenix wallet has over 10 channels, and I agree, all the payments are routed through ACINQ nodes. In this case, why wouldn’t the “wallet” need just a single channel to a large ACINQ node instead of having to pay the channel open fee as if one were actually creating a new channel to create payment path? Is it opening to a different ACINQ node if only if there is no route through the one you have already connected to?
You’re right, a single large channel would suffice. You’re misunderstood in the idea that ACINQ has different sized nodes, rather it’s a single node with many channels. It is not opening to different node, rather it is opening different sized channels.
It has nothing to do with routes.
It has everything to do with capacity.
You’ve opened many channels because your inbound capacity was full. If there is no excess room in your channel, there is no where to store the sats. So therefore it needs to open a new channel.
Consider the channel like a piggy bank or change jar. When it fills up, you need a new one.
The best solution is to think about how big a piggy bank you need, and send your pheonix wallet way too many sats to start. Say, 500k, or 5million for example.
That opens a large channel, or piggy bank.
Now send those sats back out of the wallet, so the piggy bank is empty. Now you have plenty of room in the piggy bank to fill it back up again.
I don’t understand how an app on my phone is a node with channel liquidity. Could you speak? I could give you my telegram and then we could do a chat. Everything you said is perfectly clear, but how do I own the funds on my side of the channel on the absence of a node on my end? Could elaborate more with the spoken word.
Simple, your phone is running a pruned node.
Yep more learning to do on my end for sure
Learn about channels. Most likely you made small channels. there are set fees to create channels, smaller the channel, higher the %. One really big channel, is much more useful than a bunch of small channels.
Also, ACINQ is your only channel partner when using pheonix. ACINQ had their own fees they charge to use their liquidity and connections.
Pheonix is a great self custodial wallet, but you do pay for the service of ACINQ as well as the fees to open channels through them.
Thanks! Gotta learn what all that means and how I can best use the wallet. Wanted to try out a new wallet and it was recommended on a Twitter Space.
Pheonix is a great self custodial lightning wallet, but with that comes more risk and possible mistakes, as it does demand more knowledge of how lightning works. I tried help explain things, let me know if you need more info.
Thank you. Reading all the replies and learning.
New to lightning ⚡️ since joining Nostr. It’s all trial and error for me.
I’ve only been in Bitcoin since the top of ‘21 lol, so still learning there as well.
Ah! - Welcome indeed! -- 'Scientia potentia est'
Been there, top of ‘17 tho. Keep paying attention and by ‘26/‘27 you’ll have a handle on things.
Lighting is a whole beast tho. Basics are you need both inbound and outbound liquidity. Liquidity is determined by channel sizes. When someone opens a channel to you, that is inbound, it means sats can flow from them, to you.
When you open a channel to someone, that’s outbound, from you, to them.
With pheonix, there is no way to request others open a channel to you. The only way to acquire inbound, is to send yourself sats, where a channel is then auto opened by ACINQ providing inbound, which is then immediately used up by the sats you’ve sent to yourself.
The only way to then create additional inbound without spending more sats opening new channels, is to spend the sats in the wallet, leaving an empty channel ready to receive.
Now that you’ve opened channels, send the sats back out to wallet of satoshi, and see hoe much you pay in fees. The next time sats are sent to your pheonix wallet, they will use the existing channel with excess liquidity, and you won’t lose 3000 sats opening a new one up.
nostr:note18s3xwqp8uvwp4nyduu3aerd6zkr82zvweuvc7f45rj5tzxlup02szc2kz5
I had some of the same questions, this should help some of you read through it
Thanks!