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Putin was also pretty clear in interview with Tucker that the reason for invasion he gave to his citizens ( defending against NATO ) was bullshit. he asked Tucker " are we here to have a serious conversation or a show ? " Obviously Putin couldn't plainly state that he lied to his countrymen about the reason for the "operation" but to a thinking person it was pretty obvious that this is what he was in fact saying.

Putin then proceeded to explain the REAL reason was that Ukraine is Russia and he wasn't going to allow it to be split off. Same reason why Lincoln went to war with the South.

Of course tucker ( like you Mike ) couldn't understand this, because he was coming from the perspective of conservative propaganda about "biolabs" etc. and not from understanding of Russian history. which is why Putin had to give him an hour long lecture but Tucker thought it was some kind of a trick ... it wasn't.

so this isn't really about toppling Russia as much as about biting off a third of Russia, namely Ukraine.

Dissident Sound 1y ago

of course Putin's history lecture was biased. the part about Russia and Ukraine being one was true. the lie was that Ukraine was a part of Russia when really Russia was a part of Ukraine.

Kiev to Moscow is like Rome or Athens to London, Berlin and Paris.

Kiev was the cradle of civilization and Moscow came later ... in fact Russians were so butthurt about how "provincial" ( using the words from Anna Karenina ) Moscow was that they had to build St. Petersburg to get away from that shame.

St. Petersburg was supposed to be the European Capital that Kiev was.

I have been to St. Petersburg - it's fancy - but the weather is shit. Weather in Kiev 100 times better.

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Discussion

Dissident Sound 1y ago

at the beginning of the war i supported the west offering assistance to Ukraine as i thought Putin is power tripping and needs a reality check.

but with the human losses i think now ending the war should be the goal regardless of the terms of the peace.

ending the war doesn't mean ending military support to Ukraine but rather going back to negotiations while being willing to lose Eastern Ukraine territory.

ending military support without securing a peace deal would be the worst possible course of action.

we should give Ukraine all the support it needs BUT on the condition that they will move to sign a peace deal and end the war.

instead Ukraine still is unwilling to make any concessions and prefers to keep sending men to their deaths which will essentially extinct Ukrainians as a people ...