we are not going to delegate to opening an app to fetch an invoice. noone uses nostr this way.
Discussion
You delegate to the wallet to pay an offer. The fact that there’s a thing called an “invoice” exchanged is irrelevant (and an unfortunate naming mistake).
If you have a built-in wallet, you delegate to that. If you use NWC, the new spec is defined in terms of offers, not invoices. The payer has no need to ever see or think about that invoice, it’s entirely a lightning-internal thing.
with lnurl we include a nostr note in the invoice, that's how we get proof that someone initiated the zaps (but not necessarily proof they paid it)
we would need something similar for bolt12, which is why i asked about including data or signature when fetching the invoice from the offer. if we can't do that then we are stuck with lnurl and bolt11
the main unfortunate thing is that it is 2025 and we still have not figured out a good solution to payment flows that require preimages, a good chunk of software doesn't support them, nwc is still not widely adopted...
It's a solved problem if you don't outsource your thinking to Spiral
what is your beef with spiral? and didn't rusty initiate bolt12 not them? I don't get it.
i think it would be good if there was more "here are our use cases" discussions and see if we can map it into lightning instead of acting hostile toward lightning devs. why?
Rusty did afaik yes, while Spiral did much of the NGO-level astroturf. Both representing minor implementations focused on the mobile node fantasy.
I recall one such use-case in the repo discussion being Fedimint/Liquid related shitcoinery. Solving the transport of bolt11's would have been adequate if that wasn't their priority, not a whole new BOLT to poison the protocol-level.
The shit that comes out of the NGO's and Blockstream have been a reliable counter-signal in every regard.
Wallet connections are still pretty new and not every wallet supports them as I said, which makes it really hard to use *anything* that requires proofs.
Fortunately this isn't about wallet connections, its about getting invoices (and pre-images) to the web without every Lightning node needing to set up a web server.
Right, wallets should (though I don’t know about currently) support either setting the payer_note or signing a message with the payer-key as a part of generating proof-of-payment, both of which would suffice.
Definitely need to spec that part out and make sure wallet support it as a part of the BIP 353 payment proof logic, but I don’t think exposing BOLT 12 invoices outside of the LN wallet makes sense.