What will humans do once most of the jobs are gone? (assuming productivity gains are passed onto everyone)
Or do you believe plenty of jobs will remain for everyone?
Discussion
New jobs that we havenāt even imagined yet.
No different that previous, such as Industrial Revolution many jobs became obsolete but new types of jobs were created. There will always be work to do.
Jobs will remain, tech had always replaced jobs, humans will always find stuff to do.
You donāt feel eventually the rate of replacement will be too great where displaced workers cannot keep up with the level of intelligence required to operate the thing thatās more intelligent than them?
Computers have been more intelligent than humans for decades, we still gotta tell them what to do.
I donāt think itās a stretch to say that artists and illustrators see less opportunities now with the likes of midjourney. I know for a fact that I have avoided numerous opportunities where I would have typically had to hire someone for a task.
The displacement is there. Do you feel these people will become developers or that developer jobs are safe?
Mid journey is less than a year old, will take a little bit of time but the market will adapt
The people will only gain from the growth in productivity if those gains are not co-opted by our masters. The mastersā plan is to use the technology and make the workers obsolete and destitute. The jobless and poor are the easiest to control.
Karl Marx believed that technology would free laborers from the constraints of capital by enabling them greater productivity with less work. That didnāt turn out to be the case. Capitalists controlled the technology, so they pocketed the value difference created by it, and just had laborers working for less money.
Centralization of technology was the catch. If Marx were writing today, I believe he would say the same but with the added call for decentralized technology which puts the power of tech into the hands of the masses Marx would be a raging Bitcoiner and Nostrich.
Do you really believe the powerful want to live in a world like that? It sounds pure dystopian. Iād like to believe no human wants that. Whatās the point then? Whatās the point of power or money if you live in a world of pure misery?
I do. Thatās the nature of man.
If a man can, he will live in a castle with big walls, have all the good food and services at his disposal, and not care that the thousands of poor are working outside in the rain to fulfill his needs.
The masses have been fighting this tendency for millennia. Power breeds wealth. Wealth breeds powder. The two together breed defensive mechanisms to protect the system.
In the case of the US, one of those mechanisms is control of discourse, and the creation of an ideology that justifies the wealth and the walls and the misery.
Couldn't agree more, the key is the decentralization of technology advances... I don't grind my teeth at night because a Roomba sweeps my floors.
āConcentration of wealth leads naturally to the concentration of power, which in turn translates to legislation favoring the interests of the rich and powerful and thereby increasing even further the concentration of power and wealth.ā
Noam Chomsky
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Living a VR life in the MEtAVerzzzzEEEE
Hoping to have enough savings to be able to retire by the time ai takes my job
The jobs will never be gone because we will always want more
You donāt feel there will be massive displacement of labor due to ai productivity gains? The replacement rate of new jobs will keep up with displacement?
I think abundance is relative. We live like kings compared to people from 1000 years ago but we still feel poor because there are people more powerful and more rich than us. When AI takes over, that dynamic will still exist, so there will still be the incentive for people to climb the ladder, however that looks. We can reach levels of unprecedented abundance, but it wonāt matter because people dont just want to dominate their environment, they want to dominate each other. AI doesnāt change human nature.
How does that tie into employment if the employer no longer needs your labor?
If other people donāt need your labor, you will find a way to make your own. Itās not all negative, it could lead to unprecedented levels of human creativity.
I know for a fact I can make my own labor š but that doesnāt mean people will want it. One scenario that might be a case is where people just want things made by other people - but itās not clear to me whether this would be making a living scenario
Yeah genuine creativity could be valuable, assuming humans are able to create things that AI canāt, but thatās still an open question.
Another thing to consider is that AI has to *work*. And for it to work, it needs two things: energy and data. And we could be a long way from AI being able to gather those resources on its own. So those will be jobs for the time being.
Abundance is only felt when the mind is free, and for most people our mind is not free most of the week, including me.
Iām an engineer and like many, our job relies on someone else milking our cognitive engine as much as they can.
So it seems that abundance that you actually feel is a balance between technological upgrades, freeing up time and space for us humans, but also maintaining a sense of self worth through a role in society, your family, or even your own self sovereignty
You have too much faith in what AI will be able to do. But even if it really is amazing, I have lots of wants that are not even close to being brought to market yet. For example, I would really like to take a day trip to a neighboring solar system. There is so many innovations that have to happen first. So much for humans to work on to fulfill all our wants!
We havenāt even gone to mars and you want to go outside the solar system? Bold.
Some of the brightest minds are working on long distance space travel. If you think any average Joe displaced by a weak AI will walk on over to spacex or nasa and get a job, then Iām not sure what to say..
The transition is gradual, people losing jobs but also raising the bar for what humans spend labor on.
I donāt agree. Many many jobs today are a form of UBI. In my world, 75% of people are easily replaceable. Easily. Banking, sales,software dev, customer support, marketing, etc etc.
The same is true in Japan. Elderly are often hired just for the sake of paying them. I see a ton of people doing completely unnecessary jobs all around me.
I work with a few of those UBI NPCs. You know the āgood newsā they keep creating government jobs!
Exactly. There is no end to wants. We canāt know all the things we want when they have t been created yet. For example, I would like to take a day trip to a neighboring solar system but itās not available yet so thereās lots to do until then.
They will die or find their inner true self.
Most NPC's connect their meaning to the everyday job, without it they are lost as they seek for constant distraction of themselfs which they are to afraid to confront.
Perfectly seen during the lockdowns
Every great society was built on the back of a disposable work force. Now we are living through and age were we are building that workforce. The robots can do the jobs. I am so down. What we need to figure out is the exchange system between goods and services when there is no incentive to do the jobs?
UBI will be introduced and many will lap it up. Strong men/women will break free & the world will look very different in many parts. Farming, nature, building, community will thrive but you will have to search it out & fight for it. IMO.
For those with wealth stored in bitcoin, innovation and progress will continue to lower prices of everything.
Quality of life will be able to be maintained and possibly even improved without perpetual work and earning.
In the meantime, work hard, stack hard, and learn how to employ the robots.
there will always be more jobs theyāll just evolve in nature along with society
Like what? Can you think of one example?
to pick one example would be to go against my original statement lol
jobs are simply tasks someoneās willing to pay you to do, those will continue to evolve in nature overtime alongside humanity
(will automate what we can, but that will never be everything)
No work? I will finally have time to pioneer the world's species moon-shine... 190 proof grain alcohol and handfuls of habaneros... it will feel like getting piss ass drunk and maced at the same time.
Historically, technological changes in society have always been slow enough to allow for new jobs to be created in place of lost jobs. However, a main concern is the speed of which AI renders career fields obsolete. Will there be enough time for society to adapt?
Exactly.
I used to be more worried about this but if population numbers decline as predicted, I wonder if AI / Autonomy will more people to keep a higher standard of living when thereās less people to work.
I bet thereās some jobs that wonāt ever go away, maybe they just take less humans to do
Work less..create more, leisure more.
If everyone creates more doesnāt that just increase the supply and reduce demand? What if everyone can make the same things? Think voice commands.
All the trades will gain more trades man, the way it should have always been. No one should waste their lives in 50 levels of management reporting.
Man is a lot of evolution, but there are unchanged creatures that remain on the same life, so both of us will take their share of this life
I the coming new paradigm of " work" that's forthcoming is one in which we've swung too far into rent seeking, busy body, paper pushing work that we will see a full scale explosion in the trade world where things are getting built in all the areas that have been denied this growth for far too long. As bitcoin allows for us to actual better Guage our resources and better navigate the complexities of where they are needed and how much.
Your post is making an impact.
Added to the https://member.cash/hot feed
universal basic income conditioned on good behavior controlled by social score, carbon credit score etc. those who survive, ofc, and only for plebs as rich folks, obviously, donāt need no basic income and can always buy more and more credits as they want and need.
This episode is great regarding AI: