I have done some research into 'left #libertarianism' or 'anarcho-communism' in the recent weeks. Watched some pods and debates and had some conversations with nostr:nprofile1qqs0he0gpmydkhzrncjc94ten5j79l5tjk93ah6etgtn4cwg4t6xqacpz3mhxw309ucnydewxqhrqt338g6rsd3e9uq3zamnwvaz7tmwdaehgu3wwa5kuef0enhhdw on #Nostr (thank you for that).

I never researched it, because it sounded like a massive contradiction. However, I was genuinely interested and willing to change my view if I found good arguments. If I wasn't open minded, I would have never found the #Bitcoin and #Anarcho-Capitalist rabbit hole. They look unworkable on the surface too.

What I failed to find is a decentralised mechanism that manages society and makes it work. Society is a complex system, so managing it by central planning or 'because it would be more fair' won't work. If the incentives aren't allighned with the system, it will corrupt, be ineffective or not work at all.

Decentralised mechanisms are language, sound money, capitalism, ect. They let people interact without any central authority, and are MUCH, MUCH, MUCH more efficient and scalable than any central planner.

The reason that I am such a believer in Anarcho-Capitalism, is because it's build on a decentralised mechanism, capitalism. As you can see in the short video below, this mechanism is able to manage the action of thousands of humans, without the need for any central planning, creating something that no team led by a central planner could ever make.

For left libertarianism I really don't see any mechanism like that, which makes me conclude that libertarian socialism is pretty much like statist socialism: Their intentions are good, but they don't understand economics and incentives.

And the road to hell is paved by good intentions.......

Did I miss something? Shill me the mechanism that makes it work. I am really happy to be proven wrong and change my mind.

https://youtu.be/67tHtpac5ws

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Anarcho capitalism is an oxymoron.

Capitalism is the control of the means of production by the owning class.

Communists seek to remove class.

The most basic understanding of the difference between communism and anarchism is the how.

Anarchists want to destroy the state, and believe that socialism will evolve naturally from there.

Communists believe that the state should be used to build socialism, and reder itself unnecessary, at which point they believe the state will wither away.

Both anarchists and communists have the same utopian end goal of a stateless classless social order where the means are owned and managed by the workers.

With communism also advocating such a social order to be moneyless.

"From each according to ability, to each according to need" is the motto of the gift economy that anarchists and communists support.

Meanwhile capitalism is literally what we already live under.

Personally I believe that Bitcoin adoption will be what destroys modern capitalism.

The central banks that loan money to our governments can not print unlimited Bitcoin like that can with fiat.

There are distinctions between different forms of capitalism, but none of them are anarchist in nature.

Neo liberalism is the type of capitalism you see in USA.

Social democracy is the type of capitalism you see in Scandinavian countries.

Lassie fair (probably spelt that wrong, the one people refer to as free market) is what you typically see in much of the developing world.

Who ever said that #capitalism means that the means of production have to be in the hands of the 'owning class'? I only see commies using these terms, non of the Austrian economists, mainstream economists or economic publication are using it like this.

Capitalism just means that the rightful owner of capital or capital goods is the one who gets to control it (you get to keep your own stuff). I think the fact that we see an 'owning class' in our current society, is because of central banking. One small class of people is literally stealing 8% of the capital from the class of the rest of the people per year. This isn't capitalism, but statism / fascism.

About the #Bitcoin part I fully agree, I think it will prevent any type of government from growing out of control.

"Capitalism" is mostly, just like any other word, (ab)used without stating the definition they have attached to the word.

We see this most clearly in politics, economics, monetary theories etc.

You can just label something "Far-left, Far-right, Capitalism, Inflation, Ponzi, Climate-change, Owning class, Commies, Nazi, etc. and use it to come to some conclusions.....

It works best to hide the labeling all together and just use those words by slipping them into a conversation as being obvious what it is..... and move on to first the subtle mind settings to go to conclusions, to finally arrive to the usually extreme convictions !

If we don't take a step back and agree on the meaning/definition of the words used don't even start an argument.

It is waisted time.

Once you start to notice these practices you will see how often the are abused in news, propaganda pieces, and yes in every days life.

Guard yourself against it.

Yes, 100% agree. You can't hate #capitalism in the original meaning of the word without looking incedible stupid.

So everyone who want to control what is not theirs, have to bend the meaning to dunk on it and promote their #socialism.

It's confusion on purpose.

You agree and yet your conclusion is the opposite? Wake the fuck up

He's saying exactly what I say 😀

You are parroting propaganda from the people who hate you.

Your government hates you.

USA is corrupt. Wake the fuck up stop being fools

Exactly.

This American doublespeak makes all good faith political discourse impossible.

That's the point though.

The American government brainwashed it's people to use doublespeak so that us foreigners could never have any kind of meaningful discussion with them

"why do words have meaning"

Notice how it's only ever Americans complaining about the meaning of words?

You were brainwashed by the mainstream media and education system.

Wake up

1) If we don't agree about the meaning of words, we won't understand each other by default

2) I am not an American

3) Most of what I say is based on #AustrianEconomics, which is literally held away from the public when the gov had a full monopoly on information and is getting very popular now the internet broke their monopoly, which tells me that its very anti mainstream media and anti government

Its almost as if complex ecosystems are self regulating thorough positive and negative feedback loops.... 🤔

Even a complete collapse could be considered regulatory if a system has gone so far out of balance it needs replacing with something that fits the niche better.

100% agree on this one.

This thesis is supported by theory (#AustrianEconomics)

And in practice (Countries with more economic freedom have better living standards, higher life expectancy, more happiness)

I believe the focus should be more on the political system rather than the economic system. The state itself and how it functions.

The best political system I have seen in practice is what they had in Libya prior to the NATO invasion.

Direct democracy.

No politicians, no political parties.

Public ownership of natural resources.

They, the Libyan people, under Gaddafi's guidance lifted themselves out of poverty and became prosperous, living lives we in the west could only dream of.

Want to be a doctor? Be a doctor, the people own the university, the fee is the value you add back to society with your work.

Want to be a farmer? Here is some land and seeds, here is some livestock, go and be a farmer.

You just got married? Here is a home ror you to raise your children.

Where does all the money to pay for it come from? Public ownership of natural resources, Libya had oil. Every citizen was treated like a shareholder.

How did Libya make it work?

A small population with a homogeneous society with shared values definitely made it easier. 5 million people is not a large population.

How could we make it work in larger countries? I believe blockchain might be able to facilitate it.

Instead of voting for politicians to make decisions on our behalf, we can collectively make those decisions ourselves.

That's what direct democracy is.

And I believe with Bitcoin as our money, and direct democracy as our political system, that a better economic system will naturally evolve to suit society.

Whatever happens, neo liberal capitalism will die, its the least sustainable economic system the world has ever seen, money based on debt. It will kill itself.

Whether we regress to an older capitalist system or progress into a new economic system time will tell.

We may actually need to regress back to pre 1971 capitalism before we can progress towards socialism or whatever the future holds.

Thanks for your answer! I would certainly rather live in a direct democracy than in liberal democracy, and what they did to Libya is really a shame. Switzerland is another example where its clearly better than in the surrounding countries.

However, I think these countries are just the cleanest shirts in the laundry basket. The economic system decides whether a political system will work, because thats where the incentives come from. That's why my main focus is there.

Direct democracy still goes against incentives (collective ownership mutes price systems) and is still fundamentally immoral (coercive). Because the incentives aren't alligned, it will be corrupted over time and I would say that's exactly what we see in Switzerland.

-They went off the gold standard later, but they went off.

-They adopted clownworld authoritarianism later, but eventually they did

-They even gave up their neutrality in the Ukraine war, after being neutral forever.

I think as long as you have political hierarchy of power, which every statist political system has, psychopats will be incentivised to climb to the top.

In the absence of systemic coercion (anarcho-capitalism) the only way to the top of the hierarchy is excelence. The incentives are opposite of statism, it brings the best people to the top.

#politics #libertarianism