Replying to Avatar Guy Swann

Is it just me, or does it seem like everyone is super reluctant to monetize services and relays on #Nostr?

If we can’t make these things sustainable then we will either lose them, or they will stay nothing more than a weird little corner of the internet with lots of hope but no chance of ever scaling.

I still haven’t seen the basic model of zap sharing tried by any major client or relay. But I DO see regularly comments about how expensive relays are. I mean it might not work, but can’t we TRY it?

I want to make the distinction here too that this doesn’t mean we are closing off the network, we are adding permissions to the protocol, this doesn’t suggest at all to used closed source code, we simply need the services necessary to keep this ecosystem robust, to be profitable and have the resources to thrive. If they aren’t, then NONE of this works. Economics is everything.

I know building features is more exciting. I know we all want to make everything that we can free, and I agree all of the *code* should be shared. However, I think there is a natural insecurity (and I say this because I have this problem personally) with charging a fair price, and fearing criticism or the ire of people who believe everything should be free (as in price) when we need things to be free (as in Liberty). They are not the same, and confusing the two could stifle, or drastically slow down, the insane potential of this place.

TL;DR We have GOT to divert some energy to thinking about how to make this ecosystem sustainable, or we will lose it.

(Disclaimer: this isn’t a judgement on whoever is thinking about this problem. It just *seems* like few are. If you are building in this way please share your ideas or what you are trying. I’m extremely interested)

Still don’t clearly understand what paid relays I should use, and why, but my enthusiasm for this space remains and I want to build a future where costs are low and value is high,.. Potentially with a circulating online bitcoin economy of goods/services/zaps as a healthy biproduct.

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Discussion

Some of the why on paid relays in no particular order:

- Increased reach (many clients/users only read from paid relays in global as they tend to be spam-free)

- Performance (not universally true of course, but a relay with income is more likely to invest in their infrastructure)

- Reliability (same as previous but more likely to invest their time in monitoring/keeping the relay running)

- Note retention (many public relays will clear their dbs and start over without notice if it becomes a strain)

- Contribute to a more sustainable future (if you aren’t paying for the product, you are (or will become) the product)

I won’t give you individual recommendations as I’m of course biased but if you ask around and check out the websites of various paid relays, you’ll find the right one(s) for you!

Smash bought my first, will hunt more info about others later

Welcome 🍷

This guide needs to be updated a bit (as in I think nostrich.land relay is no longer functional), but it should help: https://habla.news/tony/1680693703323

Mainly explains the benefits of Nostr.wine and suggests a few free relays worth your attention