how are you on the internet without centralized structure?
Discussion
I'm not. I don't self custody the internet
can you use software without the internet?
You think they made the internet without software?
not "internet without software" :3
you got it backwards.
"...software without internet" lol
I didn't get anything backwards
If you couldn't use software without internet, they would have had to make the internet without software, right?
Like, you think the internet was the first software?
You're not making sense
it doesn't make sense to you because you keep making assumptions.
"you think the internet was the first software?"
why would you assume that i think that?
you seem to be spinning yourself in circles. my point is that you *can* use software without the internet.
lol
How is that a point? What's the meaning of it?
that you can run you own lightning node :3
How? What lightning node software works in a self-custodial way?
lnd
c-lightning
eclair
Your train of thought is not making sense. This isn't because of me, you need to reflect on it. Stop wasting my time with replies that aren't answers to what you're responding to
You don’t own anything until it’s pulled backed to the L1… if the channels collapses it reverts back to the latest state on the L1
Now I understand better where I was kinda confused about how sats could just get "taken back"
Thank you 🤙
yes ^^
and ownership, accessibility, and self-custody are all different things.
I would agree that at a granule view that is the case, yes
i think that's where the confusion lies
Not seeing what you mean
Still seems like lightning can't be self-custodied
*meow*
(while you hold btc in the lightning, "true" self-custody is more nuanced because of how ln channels work. you technically have control over the funds (open/close channels, manage txs, etc.), but there are risks and they are not fully liquid until settled on-chain.
you seem to have your mind made up about this; your refusal to "understand" points to the contrary of your belief leads me to believe you're looking for more of a debate than genuinely asking a question.)
:3
I'm not refusing to understand anything, you haven't explained a way lightning can be self-custodied
nostr:note10dwc6e455ef58khdfz2jxckknfpk3lymq3s385dg9xt47wu6ve4syw45uu
*meow*
How does running your own lightning node enable you to self custody lightning?
Do you also say running your own Bitcoin node enables you to self transact UTXOs as if the Bitcoin network isn't still required for valid transactions?
"How does running your own lightning node enable you to self custody lightning?"
because it gives you control of the funds without third-party services. you can open, close, and manage channels. final settlement occurs onchain so you keep your funds through the process.
"Do you also say running your own Bitcoin node enables you to self transact UTXOs as if the Bitcoin network isn't still required for valid transactions?"
requirement of an underlying network has no bearing on self-custody
^.^
"because it gives you control of the funds without third-party services."
How?
"you can open, close, and manage channels. final settlement occurs onchain so you keep your funds through the process."
None of this is explaining how you can hold the funds without third-party services
"requirement of an underlying network has no bearing on self-custody"
Did you misread "self transacting" as "self custody" or are you still just repeating your view without corroborating it? Where is the explanation of HOW requirement of an underlying network has no bearing on self-custody?
Thus, the Monero Bitcoin debate
As paradoxical as this might seem, you’re also technically right at the granule level… if we were to get into the nuances of UTXO sets
Agreed, I explain lightning like an escrow when talking to people and then just break down the differences