Subnostr

Replying to Ralphy

Sounds cool, a lot of that went over my head. But some folks I trust (namely #[2] ) prefer whirlpool so I’m sticking with that since I don’t know enough on my own.

Also heard wasabi is working with coin surveillance firms, and while they can do what makes them happy, that’s not my cup of tea

Max 2y ago

We can compare the feature set of both options:

Wasabi:

- no mandatory amounts

- minimum of 5000 sats

- maximum of 40000 bitcoin

- inputs can be consolidated privately in coinjoin

- all output are private, no toxic change

- minimum of 150 inputs, up to 400 inputs and 400 outputs

- high remix ratio

- private payment batching in coinjoin

- hardware wallet signing

- taproot support

- can open lightning channels in coinjoin (not yet implemented)

- optimized to use little blockspace

- everyone pays for how much blockspace he consumes

Whirlpool:

- mandatory pool amounts

- minimum 100000 sats

- maximum 0.5 bitcoin

- tx0 common input ownership leak

- tx0 non-private output, toxic change

- 5 inputs and 5 outputs

- fixed remix ratio

- no payments in coinjoin

- no hardware wallet signing

- not optimized for blockspace efficiency

- blockspace fee of recurring users is paid by fresh users

- postmix tools instead of payments in coinjoin

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Discussion

PABLOF7z 2y ago

you can’t coinjoin more than 40k bitcoins in one round? 😩what a scam!

Max 2y ago

You can only register 40k btc in a single input.

Meaning you can register multiple 40k inputs, and the coordinator doesn't even know they all belong to you.

Fwiw this value limit is the bit size of the value attribute of the credential, and it can be increased further by a bits, at the cost of increasing the bandwidth requirements of all users. 40k is probably good enough though.

Ralphy 2y ago

Thanks for the list of positives of wasabi and negatives of whirlpool. Could you steelman the case and list pros of whirlpool over wasabi?

Also, is there any truth about wasabi working with coin surveillance firms or was that just FUD?

Max 2y ago

The tradeoffs of samourai are probably so to get it working on mobile, small rounds and xpub leak blockchain synchronization mainly.

At the current low fee rate, radically optimizing for blockspace efficiency might be premature.

Postmix tools are a reasonable shortcut if payments inside coinjoins isn't yet possible.

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Kruw 2y ago

#[0]

Kruw 2y ago

You can improve your privacy and save a lot on fees by using Wasabi Wallet instead of Whirlpool for coinjoins. Check out the benefits here: #[1]

Max 2y ago

I've summarized it here

#[1]