Thank you. I am familiar with the book.

Meat is murder (unless it is lab-grown), whether it comes from a factory farm or a local pasture. Unless you're an obligate carnivore, it's a senseless death.

Yes, industrialized farming is typically more abusive to both animals and the environment, and I appreciate your point about nutritional differences. But that is where the overwhelming population gets their meat from, and the ethical question remains the same—a life is still taken unnecessarily, regardless of how "well" the animal lived before slaughter.

For those with access to food choices, ethical considerations should guide our decisions. Some might argue about survival situations, but these represent extreme edge cases that don't reflect the reality of modern food systems. In our daily lives with abundant food choices, we're not facing life-or-death decisions that force such ethical dilemmas.

You wouldn't eat a dog or a cat, would you? Why do they get a cultural pass while others are raised to be slaughtered?

The financing and corporate structure problems you mention are real, but they don't change the fundamental moral issue at hand.

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I've eaten dolphin and horse. 🤷

Would you support rounding up all the carnivorous animals to put them in zoos so we can feed them soy burgers and keep them from murdering their fellow animals?

Eating plants is just as much murder as eating meat. Vast amounts of animals have to die, be displaced, and get farmed for their fertilizer in order to make any crop viable.

You cannot extract yourself from the natural world and the life cycle.

maybe a significant point that everyone could agree on is that animal cruelty is barbaric.

it is also unnatural & not part of “the cycle of life.”

Completely agree

id feel so much better about eating meat if i knew, for example, before eating her that betsy the cow grew up and lived on a beautiful farm at least—not tortured for her whole life.

ignorance is bliss for sure 🙈🙉🙊

The principle of ahimsa (non-violence) reminds us that while we cannot completely avoid causing harm, we have a moral responsibility to minimize suffering wherever possible. Yes, it is correct that we cannot extract ourselves from even accidentally killing others like ants or flies. The idea is to reduce this harm to the greatest extent possible while acknowledging the impossibility of causing zero harm.

Regarding plant sentience—while plants have remarkable communication abilities through chemical signals, electrical impulses, and underground fungal networks, they fundamentally lack the biological structures necessary for experiencing suffering: no pain receptors, no nervous system, and no brain to process pain or emotions.

Modern growing methods like aquaponics create closed systems where fish provide natural fertilizer for plants, eliminating the need for external inputs. Even conventional hydroponics significantly reduces land use and can operate without animal-derived fertilizers.

Furthermore, animal agriculture requires vastly more plant cultivation than direct plant consumption, multiplying the harm to both plants and animals. By choosing plant-based foods, we minimize our impact on all living beings, and the environment.

Check out Murray Hallam's videos on YouTube. His work in the field of aquaponics is wonderful, and the fish do not have to be eaten, but can be raised and released, or maintained as part of the ecosystem.

https://file.nostrmedia.com/p/4eb88310d6b4ed95c6d66a395b3d3cf559b85faec8f7691dafd405a92e055d6d/30be6ab53a3a214f295c55f2c2eded6cc92d59286850a93bec6b62f253c457d5.mp4

YT

https://youtu.be/kwOGkcFpNPY

It starts small