This is my prediction.
The homesteading movement is actually an artefact of fiat (and the globalism it results in) and will become less interesting when everyone is transacting in Bitcoin.
Discussion
Okay I'll bite. How do you figure?
I think hard money leads to more specialization at a lower level, rather than the end of specialization, by promoting small-scale investment.
So, more local musicians, fewer world tours.
More dairy farms, fewer gigantic dairy producers.
More writers, fewer international bestsellers.
More electricians, fewer electrical conglomerates.
More nurses and doctors making home visits and having small practices, fewer regional hospitals.
That is a nice observation. Maybe you are right.
I hope I am right, as living and interacting in groups of medium size is probably ideal for human prosperity.
Yes.
I don't know the exact size, but it would need to be large enough to provide a steady income for at least one teacher, plumber, butcher, nurse, vegetable farmer, electrician, seamstress, inn owners, dairy and chicken farm, bus driver, baker, fire dept. chief, music band, etc.
500-2000 people, perhaps.
Someone like a priest or philosopher, lawyer, engineer, scientist, professor, administrator, would still have value, but you wouldn't need one of each in every human-cluster. We probably have way too many of them, now, and too few plumbers and cooks.
My logic is that someone who has some talent or ability, will prefer to use that to earn sats and purchase necessary goods, than half-starve on subsistence farming.
Yes. Subsistence farming (or more practically, hunting/gathering) SHOULD be the bottom line fallback in case of extremely oppressive employment - NOT an ideal way to live. The problem with industrial Britain was that oppressed workers had nowhere to do it (farming/hunting/gathering). All the land was owned by aristocrats. This drove the attraction to socialism (replacing oppressive capitalists with oppressive government, which somehow never goes away on its own as promised by Marx).
In the hey day of America, there was some positive shakeup of Britain when American millionaires (billionaires in today's money) would buy land in Britain from bankrupt aristocrats, and sell/rent it cheap to those willing to use it productively. Sort of an early "Habitat for Humanity". (Many gave it away, but this was not effective - go figure. )
It's a very hard life. Only one hailstorm or long drought away from dying.
In the US, we have hundreds who pull it off by living in National Parks. In addition to hunting and gathering, they must constantly evade efforts by Park Rangers to evict them. (Tourists do far more damage to the park with litter, etc.) Ironically, squatting in city/suburban homes is encouraged by current Democrat local governments.
Well, they saved the money on title/rent.
If I had it to do over. I would never live in an apartment full time before buying a house as a single man or women. I would live at least 6 months out of the year in a van, and put the rest into Bitcoin savings.
I used to throw my paycheck in a drawer. Sometimes I would forget it. So my employer forced me to accept direct deposit lol. Sweet of them..😊
Also, effective farming/hunting/gathering requires decades of experience. It's one thing when you grow up learning the habits and uses of local plants and animals from your parents. When forced to relocate to a completely different ecosystem (as was done to the Cherokee in the US), you have to start over from scratch. I did learn some gathering from my mother (we went on "picnics" bringing no food, but gathering with her supervision instead). My very modest goal is to add one cultivated crop each year. I started with butternut squash - now an old friend. Added beets, tomatoes, and blueberries last year. We already have wild friend in the yard - blackberries, lemon balm, purple deadnettle, dandelion, peppermint, lambs quarters,plantain. I'm wondering how we can use the onion grass. Thistle is just too hard to utilize - it gets yanked (with gloves!). Yard has been pesticide free for 35 years (except what blows from neighbors).
We have 2 apple trees, a cherry tree, a linden tree, a gigantic walnut tree we have to cut down next fall 😢, gooseberries, Russian blueberries, red currants, rhubarb, wild strawberries, a vegetable patch with raised beds, herb garden, calendula borders, and we want to try potatoes.
Hi. 👋 I have a vegetable garden and while we do not intend to grow 100% of our food, I post under the #homesteading hashtag and enjoy others posts on the topic.
I can't speak for others, but I can say why I personally spend my time on gardening.
1. Fresh vegetables from the garden taste better
2. We've seen supply line problems in the past and expect them to continue in the future
3. It's more convienent to get vegetables from our yard than from the store (they don't go bad as fast when they're still growing)
4. We have concerns about effects of climate change, political unrest, and other societal problems causing trouble and want to be at least somewhat self reliant
5. It's far less stressful than a day job
Those are all just off the top of my head, so perhaps not articulated well, but none of them are addressed by transacting in #bitcoin or buying food.
You're absolutely right that it's hard work and that I would be financially better off if I went back to a job in infosec. And we've been doing this for a few years now and we would be unable to survive on what we produce.
And yet, here I am, choosing to not have a job and instead spending my time making open source hardware and software, gardening, and walking or riding my bicycle places when I could afford to take the car instead. I don't think that many people who are on the homesteading bandwagon are doing this because it's cheaper than earning a salary and paying for food. If they are, I agree they'll go back to a day job sooner rather than later.
Also, we are getting better at preserving our harvest too. Some of it is dehydrated, other crops are frozen. We'll eventually get around to canning. So one huge crop failure would suck, but it'll be tolerable once we build up some more stock.
One of the reasons we never plan on producing all our own food is that we like dairy products, but we don't have room for (or desire to have) cows or goats. We also don't have the land for grains, but we're happy to get those from local farmers. Relying on ourselves and our neighbors seems much more reliable than relying on international trade and food that is shipped/trucked/flown in from thousands of miles away.
Homegrown food tastes wayyy better! Usually, at least haha
As with everything, it seems a balance would be ideal. Learning some of those skills would be useful in the event things go to shit, but hooefully humans can continue being a productive race who do more than just live to survive.
Most people live in cities, now, and I doubt that will change.
There will be a bit of urban farming (and more power to them!), but I doubt all 14 million residents of Tokio will go out to the country and farm rice and fish.
I think we will see movement in both directions. Homesteaders that find they are good at it can feed themselves and sell a few specialty products. As long as good healthy food is available to buy locally, many will shift away from homesteading to focusing on earning money instead.
If a homesteader can produce specialty products to earn sats, they'd have to be sort of nuts to not focus on those products.
Sats are the apex commodity. Everyone will focus on earning them and everyone will demand them in payment.
No need to trade with any other goods, when you have 8 decimal places.
Eventually this seems will be the normal thing of shifting to specialize in a couple things, not just in food production.
If I am really good at growing vegetables, then I will likely grow a large market garden. Until I can count on getting healthy food that I eat elsewhere, I will raise a diverse range of crops and form relationships with other homesteaders. As this network grows, I see many people shift towards specialization.
I would say sats and soil are both apex commodities. Both are essential, we can not continue to 'export' soil and expect to last long. Some will focus on regenerating soil others will focus on earning and building around Bitcoin. Bitcoin and permaculture are the way forward. These movements overlap nicely and strengthen each other.
Yes, I see the reemergence of villages, towns, and neighborhoods, with specialty on that level.
That doesn't mean there wouldn't be more farmers, but that different farmers would focus on producing different things and buy from the others.
Agreed. I also feel the same about homeschooling (could be wrong). The school system we see today is a result of fiat. Once schools are started with the sound values parents actually have, we will want to send kids back to good schools that reflect those values.
I agree and I think that's why homeschoolers often form cooperatives. They are trying to create smaller, better, more wholesome schools.
More small schools ran by their community is awesome. Couldn’t agree more.
That exists in our area, but i don't think it'll properly flourish in a fiat system which is the big problem where we are.
All normies in our area are resistent to Bitcoin. They don't understand it so they don't touch it. Many of the faithful believe it is the mark of the beast (I think that's credit if not fiat itself) and won't go near it. Most of them prefer cash or will barter. I think bartering or exchanging gold/silver coins can exist alongside a BTC econony to some degree but these people seem to prefer all of this to learning about sound money.
These ideas nostr:npub1m4ny6hjqzepn4rxknuq94c2gpqzr29ufkkw7ttcxyak7v43n6vvsajc2jl is speaking of are not new but I think they'll continue to fail en masse in a fiat system despite being tried over and over again and until normies are willing to listen to the "gospel of sound money" all of this falls to those of us with the mindset.
I'm all in on the schooling thing for my daughter and in building the infrastucture as we speak.
I actually think homeschooling is a benefit to kids and parents even outside of a fiat system. Nobody cares about kids more than their parents. Nobody knows the kids better than the parents. The best way to help a kid is to customize education to each particular kid's skills, weaknesses, learning style, and interests. No large system can do that, but parents can. Homeschooling also strengthens family relationships which is a major benefit.
The fiat, government indoctrination system will motivate parents to homeschool. The many benefits of homeschooling will keep those families homeschooling.
I do agree with this but if we can create community lead cooperatives that align with our values then I prefer that. Children should be able to cooperate and learn with one another.
For me it's the way of life i always wanted and i really enjoy it. You are closer to nature, your activities move around the seasons of the environment and you are more connected with the place you live and you kind of sense the way of life and the thoughts of previous generations of people. And this is fascinating. Moreover you are more free and this is important. Of course there is more to it.
I am not going back to an apartment...
It has value, in itself, but that just means you would tend to be one of the food producers, rather than a barber or something.
Perhaps producing more goats or cheese than you need and selling the excess, or something.
Like you said, with the olive oil.
Yes you can do that of course, i do it, if your infrastructure is somewhat scalable (it should be for various reasons). But in general there is more to it. One important thing is that it should be a side project. Not your main project, unless there is prospect to it. When i said infrastructure i meant it. Also the right tools. You can't go far with a shovel only for example. So, if you can invest to it as a side project in a way that doesn't consume much time and effort for you, then you are ok. But you have to invest if you like it. And if you like it , you will make , how is that word in English, depreciation?
So let's take an example. You are coding and let's say this is your main thing. If you buy a small tractor, i have one also, you can do much work with less effort in less time and you could sell some product also. I use the the tractor also to carry the wood i cut for heating and cooking. That way you can achieve depretiation quickly.
By the way, since you said about olive oil, most of the oil producers in Greece, they do it as a side project. They have other jobs...
Same with Bavarian farmers. They or their wives tend to have day jobs.
Small garden for fresh veggies, hunting trips twice a year, sell my labour for sats, and the rest of one’s free time reading, playing with kids, traveling, floating down rivers…….i don’t think that should be too hard, eh?
That's what we already have, in our village.
I guess that's why I assume it's the natural equilibrium.
Definitely. More division of labor, more prosperity.
Although there are definite benefits to specialization, I think we have gone too heavy into specialization. Having a more diverse skillset and a more diverse knowledge set gives you more options, a better ability to provide for yourself, and a better ability to understand the world around you and to adapt to changes in conditions. A proper money makes problems less likely and easier to deal with, but doesn't prevent problems. Having additional skills, like gardening, beyond our job/career skillset makes us more resilient. Also, no matter how much the agriculture system is improved, a locally (or on your personal homestead) fruit or veggie that is picked the day it is eaten will taste better and be healthier than something shipped across the globe. Proper money doesn't fix that.
Getting rid of fiat and moving to proper money improves everything, but doesn't change everything or guarantee no problems.
Yes, it's valuable to use the space we have to grow some food.
My point was more, that we probably won't go from specialization at the international conglomerate level down to stone age hermits.
We'll probably just settle at a lower level of artisans and tradesmen, like electricians or butchers, with their wives puttering about in the garden or helping in the shop.
A lot of centralization doesn't really make sense, anymore, as we have so many digital tools that make large economies of scale irrelevant.
Agreed.
Yeah, I grew up on a remote dairy farm. Lots of hard work, uncertainty and lonely. Not very romantic. I get the sentiment for homesteading, but glad I live in the city now.
