Nostr Web Client

Huh? Nodes are ipv4 only by default with measures in place limit subnet abuse and other means of Sybil attacks. It's assured that the node diversity is higher than in something like Bitcoin that permits incoming Tor connections for p2p connections and doesn't limit subnets or ipv6 only nodes.

For those with more limited network knowledge this lowers the barrier for entry for one entity with control of a client or datacenter to spin up thousands of unique appearing nodes.

Also bitcoins culture is way less "run your own node" focused. I'd posit that a higher percentage of Monero users run their own compared to Bitcoin.

Also, due to dynamic block sizes, monero can sustain orders of magnitude more on-chain activity than Bitcoin before needing a level 2. And lightning is EXTREMELY centralized. Even if used in the most sovereign way with LND behind Tor, you're still dealing with a hub-and-spoke node model which makes timing attacks easier. But regardless almost all volume is through custodians or LSP providers like Phoenix so that point is null.

Am I wrong in any of these counter arguments? If not how then does monero not stay decentralized in scaling? How do you even come up with that claim that's not even the main "monero is a shitcoin" cope.

Yena 2d ago

Also I'd argue that if nodes aren't able to IBD (in a few days) or even sync after IBD behind Tor / limited bandwidth environments then decentralization is substantially hurt

Monero looks to be going in this direction.

Reply to this note

Please Login to reply.

Discussion

Daedalus 2d ago

You're right about bandwidth that's the major concern. FCMP does make that worse, there will certainly be a time in the future when a scaling solution will need to be invented. I disagree time to download the blockchain will matter much its already multiple days, not much difference to add more days at that point IMO. Plus it's one and done.

I disagree that Tor nodes help much for decentralization. Mostly they're for client privacy. It makes it too easy to spin up thousands of unique looking onion addresses if your node is malicious. It used to be officially supported to open up the p2p port for onion addresses now it's just used for relaying transactions over hidden services https://docs.getmonero.org/running-node/monerod-tori2p/

The key to node decentralization is to make it difficult for malicious entities to spin up thousands. Ipv4 only and limited reselection of /24 subnets is huge for this https://monero.observer/monero-v0.18.4.3-fluorine-fermi-released/ this is much more effective than trying to limit block sizes to hopefully get more normal people running nodes.

Also mining centralization is the most dangerous centralization force for a L1 which we've obviously seen recently with the Qubic attack. P2pool adoption is pretty high at around 5% hopefully this increases. Node decentralization is inconsequential tot he attacks of mining centralization.