Nostr Web Client

All anonymity means is someones true identity is not known. Privacy means the contents/information between you and someone else, or a group of people, is not known to third parties.

Privacy and anonymity can definitely coexist. SimpleX and Monero is an example of this. But you can also use both without anonymity if you want, but thats the users choice.

Satosha 1y ago

I totally get your definitions - the point is if our IDs are not mutually known - why would two of us have a private (say SimpleX) chat .. Sure two anonymous people can have a random chat - like two persons talking in a traffic jam .. or in a public garden .. that conversation is just exchange of pleasantries .. or letting each other know Sun is pretty nice and warm this morning :-) Just to rehash the point - there is no good reason for two of us to chat on Simplex :-) .. but the anonymous public chat is quite useful - to third parties who know where we are coming from ... even to random people who have no clue of our true Identities.

This is NOT to say private channels have no utility ,, they are valuable tech ..

The point is - you can either be Anonymous OR private .. you cant have both the benefits at the same time ...

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Saberhagen The Nameless 1y ago

"...if our IDs are not mutually known - why would two of us have a private (say SimpleX) chat"

For one example just look at Bisq. Both parties can be anonymous (and usually are) and their communication is private.

You can also be anonymous on Nostr and have private communications in DMs with individuals or groups that may or may not be anonymous.

"...there is no good reason for two of us to chat on Simplex"

I communicate privately and anonymously on SimpleX all the time because my intended message is only relevant and intended for the user I'm DMing. Sure, sometimes it's not always strictly necessary to be private, but that's up to the user to decide.

"...you cant have both the benefits at the same time"

Yes, you can lol. We already have 4 examples (Bisq, SimpleX, Monero, Nostr) where you can be anonymous and communicate privately...but there are plenty more. Maybe you mean "don't necessarily need" instead of "cant"?

Satosha 1y ago

Yes you can send public information on private channels ..sure .. just as no one can STOP anyone from sharing their btc nsec on #nostr :-) But in reality private channel is used only when two parties trust each other ( PGP) .. On the other hand , public information can be shared with anonymous people ...

The point is - #bitcoin and #nostr are anonymous and public channels ... that is the design ... it is for users to protect their anonymity .... you are free to use your real pics, names or email in your public profile or you may use TOR and bunch of other tools to protect your ID ... that is strictly user choice ... BUT don't expect these protocols to provide you privacy ..

You can't have both the benefits ..

because if you want to relay truly private information , say your financial information , you got to make sure the party on the other end is really your financial advisor ..

If you don't want to take the pains to verify the true identity of receiver , then you can transmit only public information ..

Saberhagen The Nameless 1y ago

I think for the specific situations you are describing it is true like financial advisors etc (maybe even for many cases), but I still don't see how anonymity and privacy are mutually exclusive as concepts. They just aren't i.e. the things I've already stated like Bisq having both.

Satosha 1y ago

I haven't tried Bisq .. I will check out ..

But we both have used cash .. I think it is NOT an anonymous transaction .. because even if we are tipping , we kinda know who we are giving the money to and why ..

Satosha 1y ago

I meant .. CASH transactions are well known to be private ... but we know for sure they are not Anonymous .. because if it is private it cant be anon ..

Saberhagen The Nameless 1y ago

Yes, but these things aren't cash. And technically there are ways you can use cash anonymously by at least one party involved (Drop-offs, donation boxes, mail with no/fake return address, P.O. Boxes, etc)

I get your point though. Usually it's not used that way. But my point is it is possible to be anonymous while also being private. There is no law of physics that makes them mutually exclusive. Agree to disagree I guess.