We are going back to centralization with relay = communities
Discussion
tru . and censorship.
without an effective group chat MLS style key scheme it's impossible to make private groups without small scale relays
also, how exactly do you figure that it's not decentralised when you have to go here for this group and there for that group and clients are gonna have to actually start to do some logic about where they look depending on what the user wants? that sounds kinda decentralized to me
like how i have to have URLs for git repositories, which is also traditionally considered to be a decentralised CVS
maybe you need to get thrown into the deep end with some bluesky, mastodon and farscape bullshit to realise how much better this shit is?
tbh, one relay per community means people have to pay to start a community, even when using public relays
communities must be encrypted, private relay or not, the hosting service can get compromised, etc
uh, gimme a break
you charge for your relay, what do you want?
of course people need to pay for this shit!
free internet is spook internet
the mouse dies because he doesn't think about why the cheese is free
pay2play costbenefitanal. wtf(O_0)
no pay no play... no playfield, no game... someone has to build the playfield so of course you have to pay to play
it's not corruption, it's specialisaton
i pay a launder'r! hey
but would you pay a groundsman?
i just had my bank unable to do a sepa transfer because the bank wanted me to tell them private things about the recipient via my bank and i thought that was rude
i'm not laundering anything, i got paid legit fair and square, and i wanted to pay my landlady legit fair and square too
at this point, i'm scraping cash and having questions about how do i pay my costs when all the fiat vendors want to act as intelligence gatherers on behalf of someone who is making threats about their future ability to do business
i'm kinda pissed, and at the same time perplexed, how long until they start putting normies through this grinder and expecting their legitimacy to continue?
i literally could not with precise accuracy answer either of the elements of the request, because they were not items of information that i had been given in any capacity, or at all
the european union is going to hell, because they are demons running a scam
i'm so relieved that i do indeed still have my bitcoins, and always did all through this last 24 hours
it is going to pump soon and maybe this all is going to push me to say "fuck this" and just pack my bags and go somewhere else
i sure as fuck am ready
already do but not enuf for a living wage. but, i have other plans also. i will check in m & i appreciate your efforts/notes.
you are saying so many words today
also, i've been fighting against being drowned by this monetary manipulation all my working life, and the cooperation of those who are supposed to represent and protect my interest
not been paid a living wage most of my life either
this is a big problem for everyone
i pray that you rent some relay services to help keep this protocol alive and improving towards oligarch-guillotining
read the name of the account you are replying to
But there is almost nothing stopping these communities to have multiple relays unlike in truly centralized services.
The "centralization" versus "Decentralization" dichotomy is permission versus permissionless. Do you need permission to join? No? Then it's decentralized no matter how many participants are involved. If you must be admitted to the system from an authority it is centralized. This is the only distinction that matters.
Wasn’t the whole outbox/inbox thingy supposed to help with minimizing centralization? There must also be a smarter way to have closed communities (channels) than relay=community
Nostr devs are too dumb. And who cares, everyone can pay for a relaybto host.
Communities are natural, needed, and an extension from real world to the internet.
Communities do not do away with the public forum, nor limit participants to any part of nostr.
Outbox tracker is here
Communities are needed but not when they centralize onto individual relays and everyone has to pay just to start one because they can’t use an existing relay by a friend or a public one
> everyone has to pay just to start one because they can’t use an existing relay by a friend or a public one
There are multiple customers here.
The most important is the community creator. They take on the work, and the cost of setting up a community relay.
In turn, they can invite, open their community for others to join. Price to join is entirely their consideration.
That is bad for onboarding. Or efficiency.
Why spin up a relay per community if they trust a friend and they have a relay already running?
> That is bad for onboarding. Or efficiency.
It’s a tool in the arsenal of community builders.
If one wants efficiency one may use twitter, or mastodon.
If one pursues optionality, and finding the right tool for the person then there is the abundance of choice and competition in nostr.
Customer decides what is right for them.