Learn the difference between volunteerism versus a politcal system forced by the end of a gun that as killed a 100+ million and ultimately failed everywhere it was a tried.
Discussion
1. What magic political system do you ascribe to that hasn't killed millions of people?
2. China seems to be doing pretty well for itself.
I'm not even a communis;, but rhetoric like this is so ridiculous, I feel the need to defend it.
1.) Ask a more intelligent question.
2.) China per capita median income is $5,000 versus US per capita median income at $65,000. And most of that income flows to the 7% of the Chinese population who are members of the communist party.
Fortunately, the only cost to China for such a great system was the 50 million people Chairman Mao sacrificed in purges and famine. Finally, if China didnt steal global intellectual property they wouldnt even have an economy. Oh, and if you're lucky enough to be a successful entrepreneur in their shit system, the party officials will install themselves inside your company and run it into the ground. Just ask Jack Ma. But other than that, yeah China is doing great!
I think I'm pretty happy with my questions, if you're too scared to answer.
Face it, every political system has a body count. Capitalism's is just as high, if not higher than anything it's going up against.
Median income in a void doesn't mean much. What is it compared to cost of living? What is it compared to medical bankruptcy? What is it compared affordable housing or groceries?
If the US didn't rely on slavery for a couple of hundred years, or didn't use military prowess to collapse resource rich countries and take them for their own, it would have no economy either. Bad people do bad things. And bad people have run both of these countries.
Are you actually out here trying to pretend that the US government doesn't infiltrate US business and vice versa? It's so intertwined at this point that Elon Musk took questions from the Oval office yesterday. Every single major political appointee/regulator that leaves office goes to "work" for a fortune 500 corporation as soon as their tenure is over
I'm not sure what you're trying to prove here. Forms of government all have bad points. They also have good points. They've had evil leaders and not so evil leaders.
How about you take a breath and let people take the good points instead of knee jerk being a dick about everything.
Wait, but what is the question for me ? I agree with your points
Ill give you a good question to ponder. For decades, socialism and communist ideologies were fairly ubiquitously understood to be dangerous attacks on freedom in USA. Which multi billionaire oligarchs are funding the mindset changes to the degree that young people are starting to consider it in a different light?
Capitalism by definition requires investment of capital and market driven price discovery. We've had neither in the west for decades and have been under a system that is better described as creditism. Communism is great if you like starvation and death and those types of wondorous marvels. When I was in China, I got raided and taken to a police station for staying at someones appartment. Any Americans who think they support communism need to spend a little time with people who've lived under that boot of freedom destruction. It really is a viscous manipulation of peoples good intentions by the most malicious of psychopaths
Sure, point taken.
I think you're dismissing the problems of western government here, though.
Have you looked around at the rising rate of homelessness? The rising rate of food insecurity here as well?
You were raided and taken to a police station. Innocent people in the US have their homes raided and are murdered by police all of the time. There was a whole protest movement about it a few years ago, and the police state was only given more budget to work with for all of the protestors troubles.
I'm not trying to promote communism as some perfect form of government.
I'm also not going to pretend that capitalism or creditism, whatever you want to call it, doesn't have many of the same problems.
And to your same point about the west, I also wouldn't call China a pure communist form of government.
I don't think that's actually been tried anywhere at large scale
Over 100 million dead last century might be considered large scale but we all have different thresholds of what we consider a reasonable trial. Very small government and accountability is all that works. Power attracts the corruptible. There's a town in Mexico that has little to no crime. It was achieved by kicking out politicians, removing the police and simply having a small town council and rotating short term community policing voluntarily.
So it's a communal society? Like the goal of communism? 😉
That's very cool, I did not know about this town in Mexico.
I agree with you: power attracts a-holes, and we could all use more accountability from our "leaders"
Communism is not aboutcommunal society. And no, it isnt, its a proper capitalist community where there's respect for property rights and lack of corrupt centralised authorities. This isnt hard. Hundreds of years of central authorities telling you that you need to choose a form of central authority to be ruled by. You don't. Try considering a little more self respect and faith in other humans. All we need is property rights and a few rules to stop centralised power authorities. We start with taking control of money out of the corrupt purview of centralized authorities. Thats step 1
There's certainly a range of communist ideologies, some of which include communal society.
Not the point though.
This whole thread has been thrown for a loop.
The bigger point I'm trying to make, and I think nostr:nprofile1qyv8wumn8ghj7urjv4kkjatd9ec8y6tdv9kzumn9wsqzq3jjwq2zyp4yrc3g0lwfsxak5a5qm4guye47x4ju5fcynggg92ayaxptge made elsewhere in the thread is that people should choose what works for them and strive towards that.
My beef is with everyone coming in and trying to bludgeon people into submission because they have different thoughts on what might be a good or bad way do things.
I'm not even a communist, so I shouldn't even be out here defending it. Just realize that all ideologies have good and bad parts, and they work well in some situations and don't in others.
Maybe ideologies are a reflection of scale. Most people, if they actually sit down and think, would consider themselves highly communitarian or communist if you like within their home and become more conservative with increasing scale due to rational variability in trust. This is not considered when talking ideologies as they're one size fits all
This 👆👆👆👆👆👆👆exactly.. well said and perfectly aligned.
The question then is population limit on societal organisation methods and modern decentralised technology gives space for rethinking many systems. It disant change a simple fact. Centralised systems corrupt and the very worst tried so far us communism. Leveraging peoples good intentions to give power to a cetralised authority over means and distribution of human energy and production results in starvation and a reduction of liberty and human flourishing. Anybody questioning that should simply get on a plane and travel
I thought I was out but you pulled me back in.
I again think you're overlooking the destruction an imperialistic western agenda has really caused.
> Leveraging peoples good intentions to give power to a cetralised authority over means and distribution of human energy and production results in starvation and a reduction of liberty and human flourishing.
You're basically also describing the US government here. Rights are being taken away far too often. Inflation and wage suppression is flowing money up to the top 1% of the US class system. Food insecurity is increasing - It's the same thing.
> Anybody questioning that should simply get on a plane and travel
Yeah, we should really investigate some of the countries that the US has destabilized to gain access to their resources, or suppress regime change uprisings that they don't agree with. They don't typically end with hand holding and free market goodness.
There's bad in both, I'd honestly argue that the US/capitalist side has caused more damage due to it's extreme power imbalance and sustained existence.
OK. I'm actually going to be done with this conversation now. Sorry to keep jumping in.
Dont apologise for discussion. The inflation is caused by fake money though. Separate money from state and lets see how we go with society
Thank you 🙏 and I agree the original ideas of republicans and democrats and a 2 party system did serve us at one point but what they have morphed into.. yikes
Wait but have you seen the chinese people on little red book. Weekly groceries for a week 20$ healthy. No real estate taxes for family property. Just seeing how their system in pictures looks pretty good. Thats all. They are shocked we pay for ambulances