Subnostr

You want to know how a large scam plays out?

Everyone uses the Ponzi term but barely know the game.

It’s a long game and a game of absolute trust.

A game where the scammed trusted the scammer with their lives. Even after the scam, they still defended the scammer.

Think about that the next time you see no-KYC. Even from someone with that high profile BTC love.

You’re going to get hurt. Very hurt.

This bull market will be the biggest gift for scammers. FTX, Blockfi, voyager , Pomp etc. Pussies and simpletons by comparison.

boston wine 2y ago

2 stacks, side by side, if you ask me.

It’s a hedge - in a world or nation with widespread adoption, we may find regulations where most merchants are only willing to accept Bitcoin that was purchased on an exchange. Or not coinjoined. Or directly KYC’d. Etc etc.

In that version of the future, it will be quite expedient to have some less-than-private sats, for when you want to buy groceries, gas, and pay bills.

It may, at the same time, be helpful to have a more private stack, for all the reasons that we already know re: non-KYC corn.

Or, maybe, the future looks like a place where the “cypherpunk vision” of proper digital privacy is the norm. In this world, you can coinjoin your KYC’d corn for privacy, or use peer-to-peer, or whatever. (Still, good to be mindful of 6102 etc risks).

I think all bitcoiners agree that Bitcoin will play an incredibly significant role in the monetary future of humanity, but none of us have the crystal ball to see exactly how it plays out.

It literally pays to prepare for various futures. My two sats 🫡

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Discussion

Shashue 🌳🛖⛰️ 2y ago

I'm down with that 👆🏾👆🏾👆🏾 approach and considerations.

ben 2y ago

Makes sense but I would not want to live in that world where we can’t use conjoin or have privacy. It’s very depressing so I don’t want to prepare for that possibility even though it is a possibility.

If that makes any sense. I’d rather fight back then prepare for accepting that alternative.

boston wine 2y ago

I get that and agree!

But we kind of live in that world now, with the exception of cash and Bitcoin where usable. Any digital fiat transaction is already logged, surveilled, and/or sold to advertisers… Do you only buy p2p/mine at home, and only spend bitcoin, already?

ben 2y ago

This is where what I do is different then what I say is right 😂. I buy all my btc kyc and coin join before it touches cold storage. It’s convenient and works for me. Hope it won’t bite me in the ass in the future.

boston wine 2y ago

Interesting approach! I have so many questions lol

- Have any of the KYC’d exchanges ever given you a hard time for sending sats to a coinjoin? Or do you send it to a hot wallet and give it a hop or two first?

- Since “you” are still KYC’d as owning X amount of Bitcoin, this approach still puts you at risk with regard to any authoritarian 6102-style Bitcoin confiscation event, or a potential “one-time, unrealized taxable gains” situation. Do you look at these possibilities as “time to move to another jurisdiction”?

- Have you explored RoboSats or any of the escrowed non-kyc services?

nobody 2y ago

👀👀👀👀 Or do you send it to a hot wallet and give it a hop or two first?⚡️⚡️

boston wine 2y ago

How would you handle an overly-invasive tax scenario here?

“We assume you still own all the Bitcoin that is associated with your identity, and if it has moved from your own address, you must pay capital gains tax”…. or an unfriendly letter like that?

nobody 2y ago

Legally or move to a friendly BTC state/jurisdiction/country.

Bring it on. BTC will find a way and the places that open their arms to BTC will WIN.

Silk Road & Ross should be enough of a warning shot which is exactly what it is. Poor guy is the example. IMO.

El Salvador seems nice. Mexico could come around too.

Who knows. I don’t think they pull a 6102 in our lifetime or the next.

ben 2y ago

Yep the incentives are there for the places that are open to bitcoin. Logically why would they go that far to push people away from the country? Governments are made up of people.

boston wine 2y ago

Great points. Bullish ones 🤙

ben 2y ago

-No exchanges don’t care for the time being. I sometimes send to a hot wallet or send directly to wasabi wallet and it conjoins by itself which is nice.

-unfortunately already lost the keys to my bitcoin so they would be unable to force me to pay capital gains right?

-have not looked at robosats yet but I heard about bull bitcoin where you just mail cash to them. Feels very shady and not convenient at all but I might try it.

-I would hate to leave where I currently live only because of family. If I had to leave because I am a slave to the government then I would. Things would have to get really bad.

boston wine 2y ago

Solid answers. I haven’t tried Bull Bitcoin but I agree, I’d be hesitant to mail cash (though my understanding is that it used to be a pretty common way to buy 🌽)…

RoboSats (or bisq or hodl hodl) would definitely be worth looking into. Convenient, private, and secure — the bond + escrow function seems to do a good job keeping scammers out. RS uses Lightning which is sweet, although their node was having issues last week so maybe give it a few days before testing, to make sure it’s all resolved.

Keel 2y ago

Lost your keys ? The gov will laugh and charge you a capital gains tax.

The bitcoin purchased by you at a KYC exchange stay connected to your ID forever.

nobody 2y ago

Can’t wait to see what they do to you my fren. Good luck.

I’ve also done all I can to “wash” my corn & continue to do so but still don’t think that will help me avoid the government. I’ve also mined my own corn but think they will figure that out too.

There’s a long history of people who have unsuccessfully avoided the government rules, assuming they aren’t smart enough to figure it out. We will see.

I’m as antigov/anti state as it gets. It would surprise you honestly.

nobody 2y ago

This 👆👆

eee8f902... 2y ago

I’m with you on this one