I'm talking about ATLs though. *Especially* considering everything working against Monero.
You would think the best money in the world and the clear winner would continuously make new ATLs against Monero on the way here. That's not the cast though.
Discussion
2017/2018 was all hype around every “altcoin” and “ICO” and the entire “crypto” market made ATH against Bitcoin even with bitcoins monumental gains (against USD). But they all (including Monero) have been bleeding out since they all peaked in 2017/2018. Wait one or two more cycles and it will be even more clear. But I would advise against waiting use Monero if you like but I wouldn’t store my any meaningful amount personally.
I see what you're saying now. I went back to check and Monero isn't unique for what I was saying aside from maybe Doge outperforming BTC if you bought before 2021.
Still, I think Monero has held it's own relatively well even after all delistings and bans.
Sure, I guess my point is it’s use case is privacy not store of value. If it works better for you for that feature then use it for that but don’t park your money in it. It just seems like a no brainer to store money in bitcoin at this point it’s pretty hard to refute by almost any metric.
lets be honest though
serious people don't think that ANY asset,
especially from a brand new asset class,
is a proven store of value after a mere 15 years.
(even if it has been stable, which is obviously hasnt)
its a ridiculous idea thst you can point to ANYTHING with ONLY a 15 year history and call it a SoV.
and the only reason we believe it is because
1. we believe in the fundamentals
and
2. we repeat to each other ALL the time
Bitcoin is at 100k today because of fiat speculation.
speculation is not SoV.
Being early has its advantages. Still monetizing
YODL spittin 🔥
Unemotionally just stating Facks.
Gonna print and then frame this
i read "monetizing" here F I A T
Try “purchasing power” instead?
as measured in what?
dont sugarcoat it.
The goods and services you wish to acquire. It doesn’t seem that complicated. Sov is boring end state. Disproportionate increase in purchasing power is part of the incentive that gets people there initially. Anyway, sorry to butt in 🏃♂️
fair enough 😀
Is the Monero argument to spend privately with Monero while storing value in BTC?
Or is it Monero for the win & BTC to zero.
Genuine question.
oh are we in a monero thread here?
zero what?
people feel different ways of course.
personally, the design of monero is closer to my cypherpunk roots and my ideal of how I want the world to be.
But it doesn't seem likely that at some point we're all using monero and cant spend sats.
most people are pretty pragmatic and when theu cant spend it directly, they use it as a L2. a lot like LN.
so even though I would prefer a world of default anonymity
its seems like we're stuck with BTC for the meantime.
which is fine
i like Bitcoin
even if I hate the NGU, Saylor and Blackrock simping community which will destroy it.
As many different approaches as people. Some might think that fungibility is desirable for a store of value. On the other hand riding the price snake might be a speculative move
👆good clarification.
Go in peace fren. Godspeed.
Beat it YODL
stay humble
being first through the door usually get you shot
Sure keep your head in the sand and check back in… how many years before it can be considered SoV for a serious person?
I see the point you're making, but nostr:nprofile1qqs0npwnpyvheqz7zuvuwvv9k460c0hyqlturds40hhfn34vufvehwcpz3mhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuerpd46hxtnfduq3xamnwvaz7tmsw4e8qmr9wpskwtn9wvhsz9nhwden5te0wfjkccte9ehx7um5wghxyctwvs2cvucv is right, and he already addresses this when he says we trust it because we believe in the fundamentals.
This is true of anything considered a store of value. In fact, the term "store of value" is domain specific to the field of figuring this stuff out; it is a trait of money coined by people that try to understand money.
The temporal aspect is not open ended. "A serious person" might consider it a store of value after 10,000 years. Some people point to gold and use the argument that it is well proven. But as soon as someone brings a solid gold asteroid into orbit that no is no longer true. So a serious person would point to something and call it a store of value when they understand the fundamentals and those fundamentals are sound. How long something has successfully functioned is just a heuristic by which to judge that, and not the actual criteria that determines that. Lots of people trust heuristics over their fundamental premises, so you can expect most people to say "pfft 15 years? I'm not putting my grandfather's fortune in that!" Gold was just as sound a SoV the first time a nugget was mined as it is today, but good luck taking that first ever nugget to an atlatl maker and trading it for a weapon. Perceived value is social in nature and not based on objective criteria and understanding for all except rebels.
I’m just a simpleton
Bitcoin is good for me to store my wealth (if you can call it that 🤣) ahem my earned value? My money?
To a finance bro sure it’s a non productive speculative asset blah blah blah.
I store my value in it so it’s a store of value
GFY 💋
Love you all just taking the piss
And you're right. You see it. You're a serious person then lol.
By wealth I mean capital, I use them synonymously, when we talk about "money" as what we are worth or what we have we are conflating the value we have accrued, "earned value" as you put it, with the thing we use to measure it and the device we use to store it. That's a psychological trick that gets us to forget that we are being fleeced via the cantillion effect. Money gets debased, wealth does not, wealth gets siphoned via debasement.
> Perceived value is social in nature and not based on objective criteria
simply put 👍
so our "serious people" might opt for gold not only because of the social and temporal factors,
but also because a solid gold asteroid is about as likely as 51% attack on Bitcoin.
or if I may reinterpret what you said,
"serious people" ALSO weigh the fundamentals of an asset when assessing risk (not just the social factors and perceived reliability of the asset)
but although strong fundamentals and increased purchasing power over time may be correlated
and they obviously have been
the "serious person" also weighs externalities that may effect the asset (like social factors, regulatory conditions, track record etc)
but to sum up
"Bitcoin is inevitable" people
are not "serious people" 😂
monero's tail inflation allows for it to be a store of value. That's why price fluctuations are so low at a deviation of around 10 to 20 USDT.
Did you get your finance degree from hustlers university?
Storing money in bitcoin makes it bitgold, not a peer to peer CASH. So at least admit that?
Trashing on the only true cash product in the entire space is silly AF and also illustrates how little most know about these subjects.