But isn't your #argument essentially; believe what Apple tell us? I can't trust someone I never met to tell me the truth. I don't understand how you can.

Apple can say what they like. It's what they do I'll judge them on. And #apple and #google do the same thing. They betray our trust.

I would judge #Microsoft the same way, if they were in this argument. The real contrast here is #Linux. If they spy on us we can see it in the code.

That's the real deal with #opensource #software. We don't need to trust it. We can see what they're doing. That's the model I prefer.

I use an #android phone and an #ipad but I don't expect them to protect my #privacy. That would be naive.

Kodachi is used by spies :)

Maybe C.IM is one of the more restrictive servers, but in any case it's only one isn't it. Why does that matter? Can't you just use a more libertarian server? You don't need to be seen everywhere :)

It's maybe worth remembering there was a time, when #twitter was really exceptional. Remember when #tweetdeck and hootsuite first came on the scene and the #apis still allowed userstreams? That was the zenith.

I think what really broke it was #celebrity #culture, or more specifically the culture of protection that grew up around them, where they could get away with saying anything but the likes of you and I would be restricted at the first complaimt.

Instead of a #conversation it became another broadcast media for those with the loudest speakers.

That's when the slow death of twitter set in

I'm agnostic about Apple and Google, but the thing that strikes me is this.

You ask Google, do you share my data. They say hell yeah. Do you profile me. Hell yeah we do.

Apple has never admitted anything until they were caught out. Did you give China access to stay in their market. That's commercially sensitive. Do you use device information to profile us. Silence!

They're just bad in different ways. Google is blatant. Apple is devious.

#nostr is surprisingly full with people whose names ring a bell but I can't place. You're definitely one of them.

Having said that I'm not the best on popular culture so you could be world famous. I better check that :)

Life's a bowl!

Thanks for the offer but I don't trust telegram so I don't use it.

I've been rewatching William Hartnells #DrWho. I was too young to really take it in at the time, but it's pretty clear now, the character we know was barely formed at this point.

Old school audio. I never updated!

There are definitely some universal truths with social media, truths that haven't really changed since I was last rambling on the Internet.

I think the most salient is, most of the action takes place on USA time. That usually means we the euros, are heading to bed just as it warms up.

I don't see many people talking about jazz here. That's probably the only thing nostr has in common with twitter :)

Thanks for clarifying.

Humour the outsider? Is Mutiny non custodial?

I think we're starting to put far too much trust in people we've never met and Apple like it that way :)

So one of my relays wants sats?

It's an odd one. The drive to compatibility doesn't seem to be taking the route I'd like.

Instead of copying the best examples like signal or threema it's halfway houses like RCS that are rising. Maybe I expected too much.

I knew someone was going to reply like that :)

That's interesting.

I have to admit, I'm not cool enough to know what #monero town is. I heard about #Retroshare on a Matrix group call privacy some time ago.

They also mentioned #MuWire which has since lost it's original developer, but used the garlic routing #i2p network instead of #TOR.

I know technically what Monero is - a #blockchain that uses ring signatures - but I'm not cool enough to be part of the scene :(

Can I ask you a question. I've been very interested in private messaging for a while, as much out of curiosity as anything else and your write up poses some questions for me.

Two or the most interesting approaches to anonymity I've seen are Retroshare and Onionshare, which can both be used as messengers.

I realise both have their development issues, but looking at the principle, why didn't you initially go this route, baking Onion Routing in from the start?