Do you understand, that correlation and causation are two different concepts. So even when this correlate. It is no proof for a causation.
And when the causation is not proofen, based on logic your assumption is simple racism. Even when you created some model to legitimate it.
actually it's religions discrimination. Islam is a religion not a race.
what evidence do you have in the contrary? Or are you just pointing holes in information you deem unacceptable
plenty of anecdotes from listening to sunnis talk about the great war that is part of their hadiths, they see these as acts of war, and they really are
if they are happy to do violence to foreigners why don't they go home and pick up AKs and shoot the guys where they came from that are causing the problems?
I do not know why they do not do this. But would not be a better solution. Killing and threatening people is bad. Period.
threatening aggression is not the same as threatening retribution for acts that are being planned to perform
these people should be at risk of being shot in the head, on the spot, as they drive their car over innocent people, that's not a threat of aggression, that's a threat of retribution
it works, that's why there is almost no street crime in Wyoming - 2/3 of the people are strapped
https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2023/04/26/what-the-data-says-about-gun-deaths-in-the-u-s/
Here would be a source to show gun death by state in the USA. As to answer to your wyoming claim. It is among the top 5 states in death commited with arms.
pew... cited by the best propaganda rags like wapo and nyt
it's not even that easy to find real data on this shit because of how much of the commie disarmament of individuals agenda is so heavily funded by USAID and Soros et al
before i'm gonna even bother to read such a thing i want to see who pays them to do it
same shit with drugs too... almost always corruption just one layer under the surface
i know what it looks like in Philadelphia and New York and Los Angeles and Chicago, and all of those famously messed up cities are run by gun grabbing democrats and are riddled with drug addiction and massive scale petty crime
also, in the very first sentence it gives away the game
CDC
oh yeah, they did so well protecting us all from fraudulently promoted, coercive forced government purchase of phizer, moderna, johnson and johnson experimental gene therapy
remember, CDC told doctors to call it death by covid if the PCR said it, even if that only meant they had been exposed and were immune
as if they are gonna tell the straight story about anything
Lets bring you a source with numbers, that are better proofen please. This is so easy. When you do not approve these sources, at least bring an alternative source. When you not trust this source on people death by guns, come with a research that goes about the same question and is within your world of trust.
i just think it's obvious that people don't do as much crime if they are at risk of being shot at
and if you take away people's guns the bad guys switch from guns to cars and baseball bats
For you this is obvious. For me not.
I am quiet certain, that from the core human are constructive. And there are ill people and narcisist, which learned to act different. But it is far from natural for a human to kill an other human being.
I look at the numbers. And they seem not to support your claim. So either the numbers or your claim have some issues.
you just don't understand how conditioning and training work
i'm a bit surprised but i guess they ended compulsory service in switzerland then?
I know what conditioning can have of effect. But I assume our difference is in a total different aspect. I assume, that any human being is naturally empathic, willing to help others without asking for compensation. That gifting someone is nothing exceptional but rather the norm.
And all egoism is something human have to learn from the society. To be selfcentric is something we learn.
I base this claim on the reality, that rarely people attack eachother. Even more rare is a physical attack. Most people know, that respecting others property helps securing order in a society. Therefore most people do not steal. I don't see the reason in fear of punishment. But rather in our friendly nature and the understanding that we all profit from friendly behaviour, while everyone looses in a system where the most violent wins.
Over the decades humanity always tends to soften more. Every generation tends to be more friendly and less violent. It is natural selction. Survival of the friendliest.
You have different beleave there. And I think this is where we differe. The rest is only symptoms of this very basic idea, of what is natural human behaviour.
Islam is not a race.
I'm too religious to think that religion doesn't effect behavior.
If one thing tends to correllate with another, having more of one will lead to more of the other. There is no need to prove causation. Causation would only tell you why they tend to correllate.
I don't actually care, why the correllate.
the reason anyway is something that i witnessed first hand in prison
i got jammed in a remand center holding cell with algerians and moroccans, because one of the moroccans was a professional translator who spoke perfect english
i saw these kids, doing their salah and all day long talking about how robbing people and hurting people was Jihad when the people were not muslims
that is precisely the mentality that is at play with this, they are constantly bombarded with this rhetoric in their home countries and all the poverty and crime is blamed on the dirty unbelievers, and then they go to the lands of the unbelievers and act like a bunch of gypsy vikings
Yes. This point I understand and agree. Jihadist defnitly are not to be tolerated. For me tolerance ends, when violence begins. And when I talk about violence I talk about verbal and physical violence.
I only argue to have violence as the measure to justify repression. Not the practice of a religion. Because it is a small fraction of muslims that are jihadist.
All bigger religions have been legitimation of violence. But the Bases of the big religions have more in common then what they have as differences.
The Thora, Bible and Koran are all books, that tell stories of empathy. Of human behaviour as most of us think it should be. Help each other. Go to a muslim country and you will see, that people are warm and always open to receive a guest. But on the streets of a big city many times, well integrated people are not seen, since they are not very different from us. But violent people will always stand out.
Those we have to act on. All together. So everyone has the dignity to live in peace.
You don't really sound like someone who has read the Koran. It's pretty short. Go read it and then come back and tell me more about how Muhammed is just like Jesus.
i've read it through twice
the stuff about violence is no different in its nature to the narrative of the bible especially as regards to Abraham
it's not the Qur'an that contains all the rhetoric about Jihad, that's mostly in the Hadiths, which are Sunni auxilliary writings... literally similar in nature to "scholarly" texts about christianity, but quite a number of them claim to prophesy things, and promote what amounts to islamic Zionism
Jesus fulfilled the Law. The Old Testament is supposed to give us background information, for interpreting the New Testament. It isn't our model for life. Thankfully.
I reject the idea that Christianity is "just like Islam or Judaism". It is fundamentally different, not least in that the only violence it condones is self-defense, which is a Natural Right.
i 100% agree with you on this... islam was just some random fork off judaism that arose during a time in which - and it wasn't just islam, christianity too, a lot of what Mohammed described as "polytheist" sects, and even, it's my opinion that actually some part of catholicism venerates Mary like she is some kind of Goddess
from its inception, Islam was always a fairly radical monotheist system, and is very much in contrast to the Christian canon as from the New Testament... it is more of a continuation of some of the strands of Judaism, even though it gives lip service repeatedly in the Quran to the importance of Jesus (the angel who visited Mary is claimed to be the same as who spoke to Mohammed, Gabriel)
Christianity is definitely the odd one out compared to most of judaism and islam, and when you look at the cultural, artistic, economic, and technological outcomes of the Way of Christ it should be obvious that it is the straight path. The only other major religion that is close to Christianity is Taoism, and both have a similar notion about humility and meekness and non-confrontation
it's not to say there hasn't been good parts to all of these systems, because there definitely is, but on the whole, Christianity has functioned as a brake on imperial power for the last 2000 years and that alone is significant. and i will just point out that Taoism (and to a lesser extent, buddhism) did a similar thing for asia.
anyhow
plutocrats, megalomaniacs, and power hungry, violent perpetrators of massive violence known as war, are at the centre of the problem, they send all the money and the weapons to the most rabid psychotic cult leader religious folks and that mainly means wahabi and zionists, and from that constant rolling boil they are trying to destroy euorpe, and the real purpose is destroying europe's legacy of Christianity
and it's very notable on that list of white areas you showed... that portugal is one of them - and for which reason i'm relatively cool with being here, the orthodox in the east are corrupt and the calvinist strands from the north of europe are also wishy washy and have been easily corrupted
i pray for an end to all this evil, sooner, the better
Let us pray that Christ comes #thoon. Amen.
i believe all the signs are here to be seen, the state of the society, even the mark of the beast is looming real close "fuer ihre sicherheit" we must KYC you so that hackers can steal your identity
it sorta looks like things might go back to a bit more sane for a while but i'm pretty sure what the left hand is giving the right hand is reaching around
oh yes, and, just to be clear, the veneration that catholics give to Mary is not so unlike that of muslims to Mohammed, they even have to put some stupid disclaimer every time they mention him "praise be unto him" PBUH
Christ is King. the end.
also i'm not gonna let this dissuade me from attending mass... i'm just gonna hear "la la la mae de deus la la la" nad then go back to normal mode when that nonsense stops
if the congregation is worth spending time with anyway
i hope they are, i already don't mind most of the people i encounter on a regular basis around here and i know at least some of them also attend mass
The Mary thing isn't as big, as it once was, as we've been corrupted by hanging out too much with Protestant heathens. 😅
good
i've read a lot of stuff, especially about the introduction of catholic christianity to the british isles and this thing of "integrating local religion" into the Church is just dishonest and wrong
"mother of God" is the worst of it. and how many cultures have this as a swear... it's blasphemy, obviously
but i'm gonna let it slide because the general adherence to the main principles, ie, the Decalogue and the words of Jesus Christ have kept a lot of parts of europe in a better state, and that's good, and those protestants, how's that going over there in germany and netherlands and sweden and denmark? lol
i wil say though, that in some sense, "God the Creator" is the Mother of all, but i don't think there is a gender
Mohammed was the Wolf, the false prophet.
Jesus fulfilled the Law and didn't lie when he said he'd come back within the same generation.
People don't build cathedrals for a liar.
Christianty isn't like Islam or Judaism because they reject Jesus + do everything to occult that he did come back. Most major branches of Christianity do the latter as well.
it's not strictly true that islam rejects jesus, but the obvious polytheism of roman catholicism is obvious
however, this punitive legalistic attitude is contrary to Jesus
i think that pretty much anyone who claims to be a prophet is false
some less so, like, i'm not against Baba Vanga or Edgar Cayce, but there isn't more than a handful whose "visions" didn't become part of some crypto-fascist cult, the Seventh Day Adventist church, for example, Ellen White was totaly a fraud, as was her scammer buddy Kellogg... Mormons, though, i think they sorta have got something interesting in there, though mostly it's weird creepy shit too
Jesus was a metaphor for martyrdom, not an actual guy, ffs
I need to admit, that I neighter studied the Bible nor the Thora or the Koran.
I know, that I support selfdefense and disqualify offensive violence. There seems to be the common ground between you and me Laeserin.
So could we might go one step further and say, that people who live by those values of "not using violence offensively, but only as a defensive measure" can take part of our community?
With this I do not mean, integration is unimportant. But I only want to find some common ground we can stand together. I am happy for your idea, what common ground we are standing on.
yeah, unfortunately i'm of the opinion that most of the dense populated areas of europe are doomed
the number of ways in which their destruction has been planned and executed are many and the consequences are getting worse and worse
the real underlying reason for the continued aggression of NATO against Russia in ukraine has really been about a money and weapons transfer to arm and equip all of the probably hundreds of radical violent religious terrorist organisations all across europe
if people think it's bad now with maniacs running people over, wait until they start encircling large public events and detonating large ordnance, and i guarantee there will be violence against many religious organisations especially during their gatherings
and then they will pile on top of that "we must do something" and do like they did to yugoslavia and bomb it all to the stone age... and by all i mean... paris, amsterdam, copenhagen, berlin, vienna
anyway, that's all coming, i just know they didn't deliver most of the arms shipments to ukraine, some 70% is unaccounted for, and if you consider that this 30% was enough to keep them warring at the front on the east of ukraine against russia, yeah that's a lot of power for terrorists that has suddenly been "lost"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_homicide_rates
One can tell many things. But in europe, there is not a big problem with gun violence. There still is, and it is great to find ways to counter them.
But no comparison to America.
I just assumed you are american, when you talk about Europe like this. It seems to me you do not know much how save it is here.
And it is quiet obvious you misunderstand something. There is no agressive action from NATO. NATO is a defensive allience. So NATO helps Ukraine to defend their teritory.
He's a European in Europe.
i was born in australia but my father was dutch born in indonesia and my opa was born in Apeldoorn in the east of the Netherlands, and my oma was child of a swiss father and indonesian mother
He's referring to the gun-mafia siphoning off part of the weapons deliveries to the Ukraine and Russian armies and selling them on the black market. The weapons have been turning up in completely different countries.
lol, yeah of course they are helping... cover it up...
Yes, but only if they see it as an absolute rule, and not something that is "flexible" or situational. They have to roundly and publicly condemn it.
I don't think we'll see most Muslims doing this. They will sometimes do it in regards to some particular instance, where they judged it to be excessive (those are easy, like, don't drive your car onto a playground), but it's difficult for them to give a blanket statement, for theological reasons.
Also, I don't care, if you think I'm racist. Only people like you worry about whether people think you're racist.
I'm okay with some racism, so long as it doesn't reach ridiculous levels. It's just an extended form of familial preference and it's perfectly normal.
