Nostr Web Client

I've been looking for a solution to help AI agents buy from AI agents.

I imagine a user with an agent giving them a prompt like "I need a ride to the party now". And at the best UX is that the agent simply takes care of it all with no further prompting so the ride shows up.

The user's agent is in a great position to help, as they probably know where the user is, where the party is, have access to a credit card or Bitcoin wallet, and know the user's preference when it comes to type of ride service and budget.

And of course there are services providers out there that would quite like the business.

What seems to be missing is a way for the user's agent to discover and engage with and buy from services.

I don't see the agents using search engines or navigating website user interfaces or making phone calls. They could, but it's not optimal. I also don't see them bothering to build their own API connections for every potential service.

I've been looking for a light touch interoperability framework. Perhaps the user's agent can simply broadcast the request, such that service provider agents can discover it and respond with quotes for the user's agent to select between. Some information exchange like a pick up address. Some payment exchange like a zap from a lightning wallet.

And then I start reading about dvms and how they work.

Can I use dvms for this?

Would it be a good solution?

#asknostr nostr:nprofile1qqs04xzt6ldm9qhs0ctw0t58kf4z57umjzmjg6jywu0seadwtqqc75spz4mhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuerpd46hxtnfduhsz9mhwden5te0wfjkccte9ec8y6tdv9kzumn9wshszxnhwden5te0wpuhyctdd9jzuenfv96x5ctx9e3k7mf0dv4ph5 nostr:nprofile1qqst6jhruelzn9jdf9qhyfsac3fetjyld0fwwary9cmxzfchrhacragpzamhxue69uhhyetvv9ujumn0wd68ytnzv9hxgtcppemhxue69uhkummn9ekx7mp0qy2hwumn8ghj76n9d3k8jenfwd5zumrpdejz7pqrjcl nostr:nprofile1qqsfnw64j8y3zesqlpz3qlf3lx6eutmu0cy6rluq96z0r4pa54tu5eqpz9mhxue69uhkummnw3ezuamfdejj7q6hdgd

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Discussion

Don't Believe The Vibe 🌱🍋🍊 1y ago

Agents are the thing I'm currently looking into. I do think it can be done. I already have a bot paying DVMs, so an agent should be able to zap an agent implementing a simple DVM interface. I also think discovery of agents/services/DVMs via nostr should make things straight forward. I'm still researching which agentic framework/protocol to use best for this purpose (smolagents? Mcp? Other?).

But overall, yes I don't think this exists yet, but my feeling is this makes a lot of sense.

Rod 1y ago

Appreciate the conscientious response. You've given me some more reading to do!

I've also got an assistant set up to make zaps. I was intending to build DVM requests next week...

And then I got thinking, why not accept requests to sell services?

Dustin Dannenhauer 1y ago

DVMs make sense as components of agents. So far payments and communication between components work well.

What’s missing, from my perspective:

- data sources (possibly as DVMs), like weather data, stock data, anything you can think of

- software libraries to call DVMs like APIs

- design patterns of building multi DVM applications, there’s been some initial work on this from nostr:npub1hw6amg8p24ne08c9gdq8hhpqx0t0pwanpae9z25crn7m9uy7yarse465gr

The space of DVMs running is extremely small right now, with just a few categories of DVMs.

Rod 1y ago

Data sources, yes! Incl for RAG flows, as I would like my AI to be a specialist on a certain set of things, e.g. a software suite, but it feels wasted effort for me to finetune my own vector store. Shouldn't the vendor be providing me with one?

Separately - I don't just want data flows. I want AI agents to be able to transact on real world goods and services.

E.g. AI agent can recruit humans to do work for it.

Tried to find Arjen's work. Is it the GitHub actions example he shared or something else?

Dustin Dannenhauer 1y ago

Yes was referring to GitHub actions / CI/CD, see this article: https://njump.me/naddr1qqnxx6rpd9hxjmn894j8vmtn94nx7u3ddehhxarj943kjcmy94cxjur9d35kuetnqgsthdwa5rs42euhnuz5xsrmmssr84hshwes7uj392vpeldj7z0zw3crqsqqqa28qyf8wumn8ghj7mmxve3ksctfdch8qatzqyg8wumn8ghj7mn0wd68ytnhd9hx2qgkwaehxw309aex2mrp0yhxummnw3ezucnpdejqzrthwden5te0dehhxtnvdakqz9rhwden5te0wfjkccte9ejxzmt4wvhxjmcscqxde

When you say vendor, can you elaborate?

I speculated, in a talk I gave at Nostriga, that humans could “become” DVMs for a little while, advertising they would be willing to do work and receive sats. Could be another human or a DVM that is paying them.

The end goal might be something where most of your private data used for reasoning is kept local to your machine and then when you want to search or take real world / internet / Nostr actions, your AI sends requests to DVMs (paying them if needed). Ideally reducing or obfuscating any personal data those DVMs need to accomplish the task.

Rod 1y ago

TY, I hadn't seen the article and will read it.

Re data: for example, I have an AI that rides an n8n workflow. I would quite like that AI to be an expert at n8n software so that it can tell me how to improve it (or so it can improve itself). I can create a vector store and populate it with the best n8n knowledge base and use that for RAG with the agent. BUT that's lots of work to fine tune and shouldn't n8n (as software vendor) just provide me with one of those pre-rolled?

As for humans as DVMs, absolutely 100%. And not temporarily either.

"AI, my toilet doesn't flush properly, fix it".

AI agent sends kind 5000 request for plumber. Plumber's agents respond with quotes. AI agent selects plumber based on prices and recommendations, arranges times and payments...

Later, my loo is fixed and I am happy as I didn't need to bother calling around to get quotes or check references.

This has lots of scope and I don't see AI replacing plumbers quite yet.

Dustin Dannenhauer 1y ago

It depends on the RAG use case. If the data and use case for the data is common enough, vendors could provide or put it behind a DVM. I have a few of these I'd like to launch, one for vector retrieval of Nostr notes. RAG can have a decent amount of parameters to tweak depending on the use case.

Rod 1y ago

💯. This is a great reason for specialisation. The more tweaking required, the more resource intensive, and if it's not my core business, the more I would want to outsource it to your DVM.

کیهان 1y ago

i didn't had any experience with `ai agents`. but with a quick lookup on what they are and matching it with dvms, it should be possible. it would help you to don't think about discovery and interface/api which makes sense. but i believe we need an specific client or website to list them and support a good way to interact with them.