Avatar
Robot Lightning 1y ago

A concept for an entirely offline communications *and payment* network.

Meshtastic peer to peer mesh networking using lora radio devices

A cashu mint which allows for ecash to be sent peer to peer over the mesh

A client application in the style of Primal, but for Meshtastic nodes and ecash tokens

Internet and power go down and the mesh network still works, and the ecash can still be sent via the mesh.

Would this work? nostr:npub142t785ujh97zzvnss8xm8jm8fhage8rxxjfaksmenfq8j4266xcs7ds6ue nostr:npub12rv5lskctqxxs2c8rf2zlzc7xx3qpvzs3w4etgemauy9thegr43sf485vg nostr:npub1dqepr0g4t3ahvnjtnxazvws4rkqjpxl854n29wcew8wph0fmw90qlsmmgt

Reply to this note

Please Login to reply.

Discussion

Avatar
calle 1y ago

Yes, this should work in case of an apocalypse.

Avatar
Robot Lightning 1y ago

Thanks for the reply! I am still trying to learn about ecash. Have I understood correctly that the tokens can be passed peer to peer entirely without querying any central service?

Avatar
calle 1y ago

Yes, but for double spending protection, they need to hit the mint once upon receiving them.

de
nobody 1y ago

i wish i knew more locals that understood both meshtastic and #Bitcoin

AustinMesh.org has a pretty good page for building local communities

Avatar
Robot Lightning 1y ago

I am just getting started, but believe it or not I am in Austin next month. I will check out Austin Mesh!

de
nobody 1y ago

🤘

Avatar
Robot Lightning 1y ago

How do you find it works in the city? Do nodes get reception at street level? Do you need repeaters on building tops? What's the ideal setup?

de
nobody 1y ago

typically higher is better, and you don't need nodes on building tops but i do fantasize about this a lot

de
nobody 1y ago

nostr:npub1ya20ep3dd0qt0suhzprxztv5y43arqwps73ercvqa44sp7qw0edsp4x9ty

Check this video conceptualizing radio waves in a city by visualizing them with light waves. Skip back to 4:16 for the start

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rL4Ebh23Xgo&t=588

Avatar
leonard_pi 1y ago

Good luck to use LoRa in a city. Can be used without problem with PoS but where there are obstacles it sucks. Plus it is very slow.

Avatar
Robot Lightning 1y ago

Thanks, I'm still learning! Have you used a Lora based system before and what was your experience?

Avatar
leonard_pi 1y ago

Yeah, just to try how it works. Good for messages but very very slow. And also as I told you it needs line of sight. If there are obstacles between two nodes you can't use it.

Avatar
LL62 1y ago

nostr:npub1zl9whkrnjlfgg9q0k39r4tymu4ty3r5uy6tgxqdnd7f6xxcf8dms580mpt have you made any progress on this?

I have tested sending #cashu over #meshtastic. the package size is limited to 237 bytes / characters. So the token needs to be split up and merged again later, which is no fun when done manually 👀⚡📡

nostr:nevent1qqsqayf3rtdhejkm4vdv0slec8pvz5z2mpsplsm82fz7x6qge22znpcpp4mhxue69uhkummn9ekx7mqzyqtu467cwwta9pq5p76y5w4vn0j4vjywnsnfdqcpkdhe8gcmpyahwqcyqqqqqqgtcksrx

Avatar
Marinatin 1y ago

too low bandwidth...would be incredible...otherwise there's no chance for a parallel economy if we go full mandibles.

Avatar
Robot Lightning 1y ago

Hi! I'd like to understand your comment further. Do you speak from experience? I have met a few people who have sent ecash tokens successfully (copy paste into Meshtastic client), and it seems possible to Meshtastic client APIs to make a dedicated client for that kind of message. Or, use Reticulum instead. Early stages and keen to learn.

PS currently reading Mandibles!

Avatar
Marinatin 1y ago

Just what I've been gleaning from other Meshtastic projects and my preliminary recon. A native lightning transaction doesnt seem possible. It's gonna have to send the request to a local hub to execute the transaction and then send a response, which could be several minutes. Not terrible solution in a black out or black marketing situation. It's been many months since I looked into it so let me know if you're seeing any new developments.

Avatar
Robot Lightning 1y ago

Agree lightning not possible because the "money" is in the node (assuming that node is not the mesh device), and also the tx itself is too large. Ecash may work because the "money" is the token itself. Callbacks to the mint are required but maybe the mint can be mesh connected, or maybe the callback can be async.