Does anyone have an opinion on this statement, no wrong answers , just consulting the Nive-mind (working title):

For two hundred thousand years, our body’s appetite and weight-control systems functioned well. They even worked during the US boom years from the 1940s through the 1970s, when food was just as abundant as it is today. And just like today, almost everyone had an automobile—we weren’t walking everywhere—and jogging and gym-going were relatively rare. Our systems still worked. Then, for some reason, they failed: we started getting heavier and heavier.

Reply to this note

Please Login to reply.

Discussion

I previously didn't know how to cook, and ate a diet of mainly processed food. I was fat, almost 300 lb.

I learned to cook, and make my own food from real ingredients. My new diet is unhealthy by most nutritional standards, meat & fat are abundant. I have lost over 40% of my body weight, and maintained that loss for 10 years.

Take from that what you will.

You say your diet is unhealthy by most nutritional standards, but on a personal level, do you yourself feel unhealthy?

No, healthier than ever.

Then fuck the standard.

💯🤙

Congratulations on losing weight by the way, something wasn't working and you changed it, that's worthy of admiration.

It's the truth. They say that certain corporate food lobbyists pay to stifle research that would change how corporations market and produce food that would fix this social issue, but it would cut into the profits of many billion dollar corporations if we collectively began losing weight.

How very cynical of you!

Of course , I agree with you, I think the "food pyramid" is a perfect example of what lobbying can achieve.

I think the roots of this are maybe a little earlier(by a couple decades), but I agree with where I think you are going.

These aren't my words, these are the words of Ivor Cummins in his book "Eat Rich, Live Long".

What's interesting to me is that this is the introduction paragraph to just about all the different ways of eating that are being promoted.

We all agree on the basics of the problem - commercially available foods bad.

The solutions are varied and contradictory, and nobody agrees on "the science".

A doctor recommended I read a book on plant based diets (How Not To Die), when I told him I had gone to a zero-carb diet. I did. I was surprised at how much I agreed with in that book, or had seen already with different conclusions reached.

I think this has to be where self-experimentation comes in, and maybe a little common sense and learning. If your own experiment makes sense to you, based on your understanding and your own research, then try it. If it doesn't work, change something.

Yes , I have come to the same conclusion as you, and so I am trying to read the book objectively, consulting the nive-mind (I'm pushing this nive-mind thing, I think it's got meme potential) and so on.

You make a great point about experimentation , and this echoes what nostr:npub1m64hnkh6rs47fd9x6wk2zdtmdj4qkazt734d22d94ery9zzhne5qw9uaks was saying.

How in that time did portion sizes change? Consumption of soda? You also have the introduction of home tv’s then computers leading to more sedentary activities at home. Along with other home appliances making cleaning easier. What was the shift from home cooked, made from scratch meals to meals eaten out or prepared by others which tend to be higher calorie per bite? What are other factors like growth hormones in meat and dairy products? What about the shift in consumption to processed soy and corn in our diets? The rise of food like products that have been engineered to keep making us want to eat. So many factors.

Totally agree that the body is a complex system, this is a very astute observation. Do you think there is any use at trying to look at "meta-trends" , or for simplicity's sake , apply a little reductionism in an effort to find a simple answer? Is there a simple answer?

After reading the statement above again. Two things jumped out. There were food shortages into the 1950’s. Even upper middle class families typically only had one car into the 60’s. So every household member of driving age didn’t typically have their own car like you see know.

In other words , people had more of an incentive to exercise?

I think a useful metric to consider, and this was inspired by what you were saying, are the difference in reasons for somebody to leave their place of residence.

I think reductionism is the enemy of true understanding.

I think complexity is the enemy of the bottom-rung of understanding.

You have to be able to explain things to people at different levels of understanding. But I’m seeing a trend towards reductionism that is affecting understanding. Have you seen the YouTube series where they take an expert in a field and have them explain the same concept several times from a child to I think a PhD student or maybe it’s another expert in the field?

No I have not, perhaps you could provide a link?

Totally agree btw , I think it shows tremendous virtue to to neither talk down to someone, while being able to spot a charlatan.

The author is comparing apples and oranges is your observation ? Do you see any merit in what they are saying?

My guess is overtime, foods are now packed with sodium, sugar, and fats to make it more delicious — ppl love instant gratification 😋, why cook when you can buy a whole tub of mac n cheese for $5 🫠🥲.

My other guess…people were dying earlier back then due to poorer technology in health. Couldn’t survive long enough to get to BMI of 30. 🤷🏻‍♀️

Bro loves a good mac and cheese!

I had never considered the fact that people may have not been living long enough to get fat at all, bringing the average down.

Have advances in modern medicine allowed us to live long enough to achieve corporeal Buddahood?

The move away from saturated fat led to slower and slower metabolism. Brad Marshall talks about this stuff alot: https://youtu.be/ZNhtHp9NcIA

I must check that out, thanks man .

It’s been longer than 200k years I’d presume. I’ve been carnivore for over 3 years . Went down this rabbit hole. Listen to Paul mason, with low carb down under.

Go raibh maith agat Peadar a cara.

I think there is a fairly simple explanation for first world obesity and I think it has little to do with exercise. There are two metabolic pathways in the human body. Glucose and fatty acids. Free Fatty Acids (FFA) are the way humans transport excess energy to long term storage in adipose tissue. Exercise can use up glycogen reserves in the muscle tissue, and this is replaced by utilizing blood glucose, but the proportion of blood glucose to utilization is woefully unbalanced. Insulin is released to lower blood glucose levels for two reasons, one, high blood glucose is toxic, and insulin is responsible for ferrying glucose into the cells for energy. When we eat constantly, and eat things that are either absorbed or convert to blood glucose (BG) the cellular glucose reserves get full. Insulin stays present, while the liver starts converting BG to FFA to save our lives from BG induced coma. Insulin presence in the blood block the FFA metabolic pathway. This means that while insulin is present you cannot utilize energy stored in adipose tissue.

Eating fat turns off the production of ghrelin, the hormone that causes hunger and food seeking behavior and stimulates leptin, the hormone that causes satiety. Incomplete protein is broken down at a net energy loss into glucose, which exacerbates the BG problem.

Bottom line, stop eating and drinking caloric substances all the time. Give your pancreas a rest, let insulin levels come down. Start by eating once a day for an hour, anything, and as much as you want. After a month if your not losing adipose tissue, stretch it to one hour per 48 hours. You’ll find that eating fats, fiber, and protein will provide the best satiety.

Regardless of origin beliefs, I think we can all agree that ancient man had limited access to food, sporadic access to dietary glucose, and no capacity for meaningful food storage for much of our history. The recent changes in these circumstances explain the increased obesity.

This was a fantastic reply , I've bookmarked it , because I want to go over it and digest what you have said (excuse the unintentional pun).

If you have any questions at all please reach out. Thank you for the compliment.

I certainly will. Thank you.

WHAT we eat changed. And the reason the WHAT changed - government subsidies.

Big government is behind most of the bad shit in the world, governments always tend toward expansion but when they’ve got a money printer that happens in absurd fashion.

Sticking their fucking beaks into everything man.