Nostr Web Client

What are your thoughts on this: “also thought about a new way to do naming without a centralized issuer”?

I love the fact that we don't have a centralized naming system/issuer for NOSTR -- keeps it free/open/flexible/censorship resistant. We've got NIP-05 which helps with more friendly names, but that ultimately outsources the problem back to DNS and the traditional domain system. This means we still inherit the points of control around ICANN and domain owners.

I think we should have a friendly username system on NOSTR which is not dependent on DNS in any way. To do this well you need to come up with a protocol/agreement for how these get issued. I should be able to show up and say "I'll take 'monkey'", for example, and as long as no one else has claimed it yet I should be able to get it.

The obvious problem is "won't all early users of such a system just name-squat on all the good names". That's usually what would happen, unless we could introduce a cost to acquiring a name. But the cost should not be paid to any centralized provider. So the concept I've been writing about I call "name-bonds". You can use the digital scarcity property of bitcoin to limit how many names someone can issue to themselves based on how much bitcoin they will bond to the name. Tie it to digital scarcity and you can make issuance more fair.

Still trying to get feedback/thinking on the high-level idea. Have you seen anything like this? Do you believe such a system could work?

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Discussion

elsat 10mo ago 💬 2

Have you checked out Nos.social onboarding?

Nostr address/nip-05 is easier than opening a protonmail or gmail address nowadays.

nostr:npub1pu3vqm4vzqpxsnhuc684dp2qaq6z69sf65yte4p39spcucv5lzmqswtfch

skretcode 10mo ago 💬 1

I’ve met other David King before…

Melvin Carvalho 10mo ago

I thought we figured this out, e.g. with nomen, and others

If you dont want reliance on DNS use #pubky

These are problem with solutions

David King 10mo ago

sorry i was not aware of the solutions. is the pubky you’re mentioning this one: https://pubky.app

i dont understand how to use it to issue myself a name.

Garbage nsec 10mo ago

Could just move to support resolution of https://handshake.org/ domains, you can buy one on https://www.namebase.io/ or even on namecheap if you are ok with an extension they own (namebase by contrast lets you get your own extension).

There are already systems to prevent squatting (automatic Vickrey auction for new registrations, etc.) and these work well enough. The NIP-05 system would remain the same, still pop a json same place, just allow for resolution of handshake. So it wouldn't break the design of the current NIP-05 system.

As for bitcoin there are some that at first glance seem to be like what you mean, like https://www.namecoin.org/dot-bit/ , but these actually are forks of bitcoin and don't require any bitcoin ownership, so it's the same concept as handshake more or less (another chain), but handshake is the one with traction and ease.

David King 10mo ago

yea, i overall like the approach of running a naming system parallel to NIP-05 versus a replacement. let people choose what they want.

i worry about the HNS airdrop schemes and an alternative proof of work network. i also don’t know how you run auctions without a centralized order book. does this mean a centralized issuers is required?

Garbage nsec 10mo ago

Also handshake for relays. The .lol domain is owned by GoDaddy (they paid for the rights to administer it). If GoDaddy decides that the nos.lol relay can't control the worst kinds of spam they can terminate the agreement for nos.lol. That relay is like a load-bearing pillar for Nostr at the moment, and that termination could happen any morning.

PABLOF7z 10mo ago 💬 3

It can't work. Zooko's triangle.

Gigi and I recorded an episode of our podcast precisely about this. Iirc, it was episode two of nostr:npub1n00yy9y3704drtpph5wszen64w287nquftkcwcjv7gnnkpk2q54s73000n

David King 10mo ago

listening now 👂

https://haven.sovereignengineering.io/454ec3ebf261084fe0abbcb6b31409cb29db23ed97784f896b60d7226bfe17ba.mp3

034b387b... 9mo ago

Why not build a rollup on Celestia

Nuh 9mo ago

What do you think about Urbit names? Something like "ravmel-ropdyl" ... a name that is readable and maybe memorable, at least as much as phone number, but we can do it so that it is "unmonetized", meaning you can't choose it, you can't sell it, you don't need to renew it, just a random name that you get if you pay the Bitcoin fees to the miners.

If you are interested in that, let me know, I am working on a spec for that to compliment my work on Pkarr.org, for the occasions that short readable names are necessary.

David King 9mo ago

I’d love to review and give feedback on the spec you’re working on. I haven’t used Urbit names. I had not considered 1) readable/memorable but 2) “unmonetized” as a path and I’d like to learn more about the benefits/tradeoffs here.

My assumptions were that most people would expect to be able to pick a name that feels personal/self-expression-oriented. I also assumed the “land-grab” nature of user-selected/personal/attractive/“monetized” would draw people in to own/speculate which can be a powerful marketing tool for a new system.

I haven’t seen an approach that both 1) admits those assumptions while 2) avoiding a centralized issuer/marketplace/“DAO” entity to receive payment/throttle-the-landgrab of issuance. that’s the particular set of tradeoffs I’ve been exploring, but I’m interested in learning about lots of different approaches

I suspect naming is an important area to innovate to make decentralized technologies simpler for more people to understand/use.