My primary observation is that this relates to Jesus’ command to love your enemy, and the parables of the Good Samaritan, and the Cheerful Giver.
All these are examples of giving where there was absolutely no expectation (or even possibility of) mutual return.
Perhaps that was Jesus point, to purify the act of giving by practicing it’s quietly and to those from whom you believe there will be no possible return.
I think this is why zapping anonymously is so powerful.
Your not anonymous tho. Cause your wine filter relay tells other who ya zappin & amounts
Really? I didn’t know that? Would normal people have the skills to figure that out?
Yes. #[5] taught me
He was using his own node though?
Yes, you need your own zapper. 🐶🐾🫡
Right. My understanding was you needed your own node?
Not node specifically, but the thing that serves lnurlp and the one that gets the callback when payment is processed. You basically get the list of relays that user has configured and potentially can tell who it is, using the sometimes unique signature of the relays (npub, Private relay with unique addresses, combination of relays, etc) 🐶🐾🫡
So you can match a list of relays someone has, but that still doesn’t “prove” it was them?
With filter.nostr.wine it was easy. Npub is in relay url.🐶🐾🫡
This is a great point to discuss threat profiles, faux privacy, and verifiable anonymity.
If the point of a private zap is to give a gift anon, there is little reason to dig to figure it out except morbid curiosity.
If you are donating to a cause that’s illegal in your country, etc… that’s a whole different kettle of fish then ain’t it?
Exactly! My point was that you could profile people based on this things. Faux anonymity is no good, especially if users believe they are. 🐶🐾🫡
It is difficult to find the correct terminology for these things. How do we describe shades of anonymity?
Pseudo anonymity! 🐶🐾🫡
No matter how I spin it, LN is also traceable if needed, so is bitcoin transaction.
At the end of the day, all of it is pseudo anonymous.
It’s all one exploit, cracked code, or zero day away from being plain to read.
Precisely! 🐶🐾🫡
Deferring to your expertise Fish, does the NIP-46 auth affect the npub visibility with filter?
It removes it and secure, so we are good. I am more worried about relay list being sent with nip-57 spec. Maybe it shouldn’t do that for anon zaps. Many users have unique relay configuration, plus add the amount signature and timing, and you have much smaller list of people to ID. Add pfp download and nip-05 and even narrower profile surface. Anonymity is hard problem and many holes that can be used to narrow down people. 🐶🐾🫡
You really are the best #[5] you know that right?
Both of you are the best. Thanks for the education!
🐶🐾😂🤣 just have experience in the field of security, that’s all! By far not the best! 🐶🐾🫂🤣💜
Your sharing of knowledge helps us setup security for ourselves, or at minimum think of better ways to protect ourselves online. I always pay attention to what ya write, cause I kno it’ll better my skills. Except that one time where I reeeeellllliiiiii missed the memo 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Main takeaway should be that you are not fully anonymous whenever you are online. The longer you hold one identity the easier it is to find who you really are. Act accordingly, and use other identities and sources to stay anon when you need to. The more you use the same things, e.g., IP, nickname, wallet, phone, providers of services, the easier it is to narrow down on you. Even your notes patterns and words you use, especially in the age of AI. We might not notice it, but patterns are there. 🐶🐾🫡
Totally. So many many many things factor in
#[3] , lot of what #[5] #[4] discussing is dev stuff. Not regular ppl speak. But main take away point is that zaps are likely almost never anonymous… even when ya toggle it to anon. Even if I don’t kno how to figure it out, I can easily ask someone else that knows how
Want be anon, can’t use filters, must be on vpn, and bunch other things. Still metadata attached
Is t everyone on vpn 😂
🤣🤣 sadly nooo
I don’t run one 90% of the time. I move around a lot, and there is very little you can get from my IP address that you couldn’t guess from other things.
GeoIP is far from precise and often flatly wrong.
GeoIP?
Go to whatismyip.com and see what city it thinks you’re in (without vpn)
Mine is not correct. GeoIP is a database that attempts to place IP addresses at a location on the map.
Mine was correct 😂🤷♂️.
Depending on where you live it can be. But it is far from reliable.
Threat profiles means understanding who’s after you. Are you controversial? Stirring up techno savvy groups? Violating the law?
If the answer is no, then nobody is going to dig hard enough to do more than narrow you down to say, +/- 100 miles.
90%+ of anonymity online against anyone other than the state is controlling your mouth. Almost everyone ends up giving themselves away. Use a burner email and don’t tell anyone unique things about yourself. Enough of these, and you can be identified.
In the US, 87% of people are identifiable with only zip code, gender and date of birth.
🤖 beep boop
Even style of writing is give away. It’s nearly impossible to be anon
Reference for claim: https://dataprivacylab.org/projects/identifiability/paper1.pdf
34 pages. Coles notes pls lol
Most important takeaway:
“It was found that 87% (216 million of 248 million) of the
population in the United States had reported characteristics that likely made them unique based
only on {5-digit ZIP, gender, date of birth}. About half of the U.S. population (132 million of 248
million or 53%) are likely to be uniquely identified by only {place, gender, date of birth}, where
place is basically the city, town, or municipality in which the person resides. And even at the
county level, {county, gender, date of birth} are likely to uniquely identify 18% of the U.S.
population. In general, few characteristics are needed to uniquely identify a person.”
The rest is backing up the claim.
Kool. Thx.
Normal ppl also have smart computer friends. So if they don’t kno, they ask one’s that do.
Ok this be hard one to debate. 🤔 Cause ya religion brings diff thoughts. Lemme get back to this
