Nostr Web Client

Although he doesn't present the tradeoffs in a good way

I do appreciate STN calling attention to the inherently difficult task of concealing data that appears publicly on a blockchain.

and yes

FCMP fixes most of this.

in the meantime you can churn your XMR a hop or two (randomly!).

and use proxies/ephemeral nodes on LN to improve your privacy.

on a side note,

FCMP and other protocol upgrades are only possible AT ALL

because the culture around the project will accept a hard fork.

so.

maxis can suck it.

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Super Testnet 8mo ago

"FCMP fixes most of this"

Lightning is already ahead of monero on privacy tech. If they eventually get around to adding support for FCMP (next year? year after?) I look forward to find out if FCMP even does what it claims to do.

But even if it does, it will still be worse than lightning.

FCMP accomplishes a similar goal as lightning (make the payment info look like something *anyone* could have made -- LN does this by making it an indecipherable encrypted blob, FCMP does this via a much larger zero knowledge proof).

But FCMP's method is much less efficient way. Not just because it uses a far greater number of bytes, but also because every payment goes on the blockchain, and you have to *pay for* all of those bytes. It costs a far greater amount of money to use FCMP than it costs to use lightning, and for all that cost, the effect you get is roughly the same: people can't tell who sent the payment anymore.

Lightning is better than FCMP.

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Discussion

Saberhagen The Nameless 8mo ago

Lightning (or any other L2) built on an encrypted blockchain like Monero would be superior. It would be way more feasible to enforce on-chain because fees will always be much cheaper on Monero thanks to tail emission and dynamic blocks.

As a whole it's also better to build on an encrypted blockchain if your goal is privacy

Super Testnet 8mo ago

I would certainly like to see lightning on monero and I think I know a way to do it, though it's not pretty -- you'd have to make a bunch of presigned transactions for every block a txo "might" get mined in at an unknown point in the future.

But bitcoin is the better blockchain to build lightning because of its small block size. That's the only way I think is sensible for keeping a blockchain decentralized. Monero is garbage money because it is centrally controlled and designed to centralize further as usage increases. Blocks get bigger -> nodes get harder/more expensive to run -> regular folks stop doing it -> the rich control the network

Bitcoin is designed to last. Monero is designed to die fast.

Saberhagen The Nameless 8mo ago

FCMP brings transaction chaining, but I've seen ZK Rollup schemes being discussed. Too early to tell what is going to happen.

I could argue Bitcoin has been too conservative. Bandwidth, hard drive capacity, and affordability have all dramatically increased since the creation of Bitcoin. I see China is now improving their internet infrastructure for 10Gbps bandwidth now.

small fixed blocks and increasing adoption mean -> only rich will be able to afford on-chain transactions or to enforce their LN channels -> no incentive for most users to run a node if they can't use the chain -> rich control the network

Tens of millions of Bitcoin users and only ~60k nodes. Not even a fraction of one percent are running their own node. So much for small blocks.

I guess time will tell

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/technology/tech-news/worlds-first-10g-broadband-network-launched-in-china-how-fast-is-10g/articleshow/120485407.cms

rafael_xmr 8mo ago

Bitcoin is centrally planned by a council that you need to be hired by a company like blockstream or chaincode labs and give your KYC info to get a monthly salary to participate in and merge commits to the core codebase.

This council have decided that the block size should have been increased to 4mb (huge blocks), and no one has a say in this, and no one has a say in the future of their money.

Monero has decided to let the community decide so it kept blocks small (300kb) and it can increase in the future (if needed, but with a penalty for doing so) so that only users of the network can control it.

The next Monero upgrade will make its privacy perfect and allow for L2 and scaling solutions to be built, once again removing the load off of the blockchain and allowing it to stay small, forever. No 4mb blocks here.

Choose neutral money, choose apolitical money, choose money that you control and your privacy it protected. choose #Monero

goatmeal 8mo ago

people are way too excited about the "and it enables L2" idea that was vaguely tacked onto FCMP++. a lot more work will be needed to prepare monero to support a L2 that won't suck to use.