I didn't mean it as the strictest one-size-fits-all solution. We all have to eat, so we have to do what we have to do to survive.
But (here's my morality advice) it should be the norm for a mother not to routinely leave her children for others to look after.
Why hold a mother entirely responsible for a child’s care? What about the father? What about having large community support when raising a child?
Mom and Dad are both responsible, but we need not expect them to share the same roles in parenting. Men and women are different; moms and dads are different.
Women are even blessed to have a reflection of their nurturing gifts built into their bodies. They grow their children inside their bodies, and feed them with their bodies, giving of themselves. It's a beautiful thing.
Men are typically stronger and more aggressive, less "nurturing" but more protective and geared toward leadership. Women don't like wimps or sissies, and men don't like barking, independent broads. There is a complementarity between the sexes and between mothers and fathers.
We don't have to pretend we're equal. We're different, and that's okay. We can be different but equal in worth and dignity. Though I have to say women are pretty special. Y'all are awesome.
I think you have too narrow a viewpoint. I’m sure you’ve heard the phrase it takes a village to raise a child. I’m glad I had a village. I am privileged to be a member in other kiddo’s villages. I’m glad the women in my life are supported in participating in society beyond motherhood. Their gifts are immeasurable.
I think people forget the roots of this phrase. It’s the natural order of things, and our modern day attempts at parenting in isolated bubbles are actually proving to be highly ineffective.
I’m lucky enough to live in close proximity to a few of my family members, we helped my sister raise her kids and now they help me raise mine on a day to day basis, when you see it in action you can understand why and how it works. I’m happy to hear you had this experience too and also pay it forward.
I think most people just can’t fathom the situation because they’re cut off from having the option
Men and women may TEND to be different, but individuals are ALWAYS different. It’s unreasonable to shackle an individual to a role based on a generalization.
You’re painting men in your image when you say you don’t like independent women. Plenty of men actually do. And almost no women enjoy being barked at, either.
I see in your profile that you’re Christian. When you call God Father, do you not believe He is nurturing and self-giving? Communion is also being fed by His body, is it not?
I’m Christian, too, and I don’t believe that God has gifted skill and intelligence to women just for them to be hidden away any more than I believe God has withheld any part of His nurturing heart from men.
Thank you!
A lot could be said here, but as one who loves and respects women, I would not say they are "hidden away" when they stay at home to care for the family.
I'm not buying our society's lie that a woman reaches her full potential only when she finds employment away from the home. Her role as mother and homemaker is an awesome responsibility to be honored, not belittled.
Ask any honest, non-simping man if he would not love to have a wife who cares for their children at home during the day, who makes their house a home, who acts like a wife instead of a husband. His answer will be YES. Even HECK YES.
And ask yourself: Would you really respect a husband who chooses to stay at home instead of going to work; who expects you to go out and make money; who focuses on looking after the children, bottle-feeding them, and putting them down for nappy time; who do some sewing or decorating or reading; who ask what you'd like to eat after a hard day at the office? Deep down, I think you would say NO. Even HECK NO. I don't think your marriage or romance life would thrive in that situation.
The extreme shallowness of your “love and respect” for women has been apparent from the very first post, from your constant condescending language about them to your disdain for the roles you would consign them to.
Yes, I would have the utmost respect for a husband who cares for the children, sews, decorates, etc. because I see value in all of that. You seem to just see virtue signaling that you can have at your disposal there instead. Gross.
You are the one belittling the homemaker role when you use patronizing language about it and belittle men for filling it. If it’s so awesome (and it is), celebrate all who take it on.
As far as your other points go: if a woman has the desire and ability to succeed in a career, but doesn’t because of the belief that she shouldn’t have one, yes, I call that part of her hidden away.
I don’t think that anyone’s highest potential, man or woman, is fulfilled only in having a career. Our highest potential is reached when we are the people God created us to be in full. Like me, you clearly believe in men having a full life involving family, career, faith, and probably hobbies as well. I’m just saying women are no different.
I don't belittle homemaking, but I do belittle the idea of men choosing to be homemakers while their wives go out into the workforce (working for and with other men). It's the reversal of roles I take issue with, not the roles themselves.
I believe we should all have a full life, but that involves committing to fulfilling our state in life the best we can -- not just doing anything we feel like.
Children deserve to be raised by their parents, no matter how "shackled" the parents may feel by that at any given moment.
When husband and wife don't fulfill their roles, chaos and contention are ready to pounce. Spouses' equally important roles may have some overlap, but they are not interchangeable.
Children need dads who are dads and moms who are moms, according to God's design.
I think you need to reread the Bible a bit more carefully if you truly believe that what you’ve been saying about gender roles is God’s design.
Your argumentation is sloppy and you keep strawmanning me. For just one example, I never suggested anyone just “do anything they feel like.” And you did in fact belittle homemaking if it was a man doing it — not simply the man doing it. Do better
Ok, let’s talk should.
It should be the norm for both parents to devote significant time and energy to caring for their children, but also for childcare to not be their entire life.
It should be the norm that families who in good faith seek to be involved are not shamed for seeking childcare help from others, especially extended family members and friends, but even well-vetted paid help when necessary.
If you’re going to advocate wholesale cultural change, maybe don’t force fit mothers back into boxes they’ve long made clearly known are too small for them, or expect them to carry the extremely difficult task of parenthood literally alone. Instead, maybe spread the following ideas:
Fathers are just as responsible for child rearing as mothers are and it’s good for career culture to recognize this.
Modern culture for some reason has grown very divorced from valuing the extended family, a source of childcare support since prehistory. Extended family support can help create healthier, more stable families and children who benefit from the wisdom of their parents’ elders.
Many modern workplaces currently make it unnecessarily difficult / impossible to have children around. Workplaces have long been (and can be again) great places for supervised children to learn decent behavior and useful career skills. I’d say it’s better they hang out with mom or dad at work than sending them to government school for sure.
I agree with all of this. Except, and I know this will probably be an unpopular opinion on Nostr, I think public schools can be great. The concept of public education is amazing to me.
The idea of government school just hits different for anarchists 😂 and for people who had as awful a gov school experience as I did (or far worse), especially if they then experienced how much better homeschooling was.
I liked school. I personally much preferred a Montessori school I attended and a small private school. I did attend public school as well. It was hit or miss. I can think of many issues with public education but I like the concept of public education.
Our first solution should not be to tell women to get back in the kitchen, but to offer help to the parents we're friends with. Help them tidy up the house, cook dinners for them, watch the kids while their mother works a shift. That's real and attainable cultural change.
Why does Mother have to work a shift?
