For the Muslims out there who think the fiat Keynesian system is “a good idea” let’s have a look 👀…

Allaah said in the Quraan about prophet Shuaib:

And to Madyan [We sent] their brother Shuʿayb. He said, O my people, worship Allāh; you have no deity other than Him. And do not decrease the measuring scales [when doing trade, by volume or weight]. Indeed, I see you in prosperity, but indeed, I fear for you the punishment of an all-encompassing Day.

And O my people, give full measure [in volume] and weight in justice and do not deprive the people of their due and do not commit abuse on the earth, spreading corruption.

Hud, Ayah 84-85

One of the reasons why the Shuaib was sent to his people was because of their financial corruption, cheating in trade, and their **manipulation** of the tools used for trade. So what does one say about those who manipulate the value of the currency we’re supposed to use to measure value? By deliberately inflating and deflating the quantity of money in the markets?

How can a carpenter build a table if his ruler keeps on changing length or a baker bake a cake if his cup keeps on changing its volume? When the tools used to measure 📐 📏 things with are constantly being manipulated?

Reply to this note

Please Login to reply.

Discussion

The unbelievable thing is that a student will typically go through 12-13 years of schooling and then 4 or more years of without studying this subject as part of the curriculum even though what most people are trying to earn!

* 4 or more years of university...

It truly is insane.

Could you explain how proof-of-stake nullifies the issue some scholars bring up about the need for some sort of issuing authority when it comes to currency in Islam?

I don’t think it nullifies anything, rather to think it raises further issues. Proof of stake means to use money to ‘stake’ so you get get more money. Just from that simple crude explanation it looks like Ribaa. Now I’m not saying outright that it is, but that would be the first potential objection.

Now looking at whether it is Ribaa or not, it really depends on the implementation of the PoS. I’m not a specialist in PoS, so confirm what I say further, but with protocols like Ethereum, you lose access to your stake as a result of the stake, and you even have to wait in a ‘cue’ before you can withdraw it. Losing control of your money is one of the characteristics of a loan. It’s no longer “yours”. The fact you have to send it to an address you are not in control over is what a loan would look like on a blockchain.

However, not all PoS are created equal apparently. Apparently, and Allaah Knows best, you have to verify it, with Cardano, when you “stake” your ADA, you don’t actually lose control over it. It’s staked with a staking pool, but it doesn’t leave your wallet. So you could spend it immediately, as I was told. If that’s the case, then it’s not a loan.

So looking at the above, ie would “seem” that ETH is a loan that gets you profit (ie the definition of Ribaa) whereas ADA seems to act like a business partnership where you use your “reputation” to gain rights to profits owned by someone else who is doing the hard work of validating transactions.

The one argument to be made that ETH staking is not Ribaa is the fact that you have to actually do work in order to gain profit, ie profit is not guaranteed. That’s important, and you could lose your money if you misbehave, also something that is not a characteristic of a loan.

But the issue with PoS, for those who have issue with PoW is that there is even less real world tangibility than ₿itcoin , so if they have issue with BTC, then PoS would be worse.

What would you say to the Shafi’i (and other) perspectives that currency in Islam needs to be tangible and hard, with intrinsic value? That Islamically, bitcoin could be considered an asset but not a legal currency, according to some fatwas.

Well, I’ve covered this topic in many videos, but my most recent one covers it in the most in depth detail, although it is a bit long

https://youtu.be/pPk8af7lzbQ

Thank you, I’ll take a look. I’ve only heard a couple of Muslim bitcoiners bring up the potential for bitcoin to transition away from a riba-based economy and I’m very interested in learning more.

Regarding that specific topic of Ribaa, fiat and how Bitcoin can help, then refer to this video

https://youtu.be/QdqOFZdLE7M