also, i feel as if a lot of people have fallen for the psyops of the small percentage of just awful human beings who use feminism as a front to be hateful. nostr:note1atmg6rlhlt4v6supmervl5p3z4rur7gm2hssadwnjmq5dn47ypxqct99dy
Discussion
YUP
I'm a feminist. Let's have a woman president. Let's pay women the same as men. The number of women that have told me, a man, that all men are trash is not cool.
understandable and you’re absolutely correct. i will say that women who say that have probably gone through some traumatic shit and have exaggerated that to men as a whole.
which is very wrong, but should be noted that there’s usually a deeper issue when anyone says that, and they should solve with themselves
Yeah totally get that which is why I don't push back or get bent out of shape about it. I'm not the one to say "well not all guys..."
But it feels bad to hear that, sometimes from people I really care about
Women are paid appropriately for the kind of work they do & the life choices they tend to make. The highest paid demographic among people who make similar choices (comparing apples to apples) is unmarried asian females.
Grouping purely along male/female lines while taking nothing else into consideration is completely dishonest & a lot of the people promoting that nonsense know exactly what they are doing. #divide&conquer
i understand what you’re trying to get at, but by saying grouping is a negative thing, whilst saying that “women are paid appropriately for the kind of work they do & choices they tend to make” is doing the exact thing you said is bad. you’re grouping all women.
Read what I typed again & think about it a little harder. I'm literally saying the aggregate numbers are irrelevant & that dividing people along those lines while ignoring the choices they make is shitty & dishonest, or maybe it's just stupid (hard to tell the difference). It would be completely unreasonable to pretend men & women are indistinguishable from one another.
of course there’s always going to be differences in men & women, but you can’t write off every gender inequality as an effect of individual choice. it’s historically engrained in societies, and it’s okay to know that it was a bad thing, and that we can change those without putting men down or not accounting for the individual choices of both genders. we don’t have to agree on it, but denying misogyny (+ misandry) and it’s effects on the present day is bad for both genders.
When someone can say men & women or whites & blacks or whoever & whatever should be treated equally & everyone generally agrees or applauds the sentiment, then there generally isn't a discrimination problem. When a society is plagued by real problems most are generally afraid to talk about it, & people get persecuted for pointing them out. But once a problem is actually solved cowards tend to come out of the woodwork trying to pretend it's still an issue so that they can manufacture some social status & a sense of self worth by pretending to be some sort of rebel. And politicians (career criminals) always work to capitalize on such movements.
Listen to Mr. Black Economics man talk about these issues all the way back in the 80s
hey i actually agree with you on this.
Being around feminists is the problem.
They hate men and they hate themselves.
Anyone who is focused on promoting one sex or the other is no different from people promoting one race or another. It's stupid & weak.
i agree with you here and that’s what i was saying in the op. feminism is misconstrued as focusing on promoting one sex over the other, when that’s not the case at all. the minority of “feminists” who do that, use feminism as a front to be misandrists. that’s not okay nor is what historically feminism was at all.
Maybe, but if I walked around identifying myself as pro-male or pro-white (while meaning that I just want equality) can you imagine how that might come across & what sort of people I might attract?
People who want equality need to focus on humanity & unity, not divisions.
but that’s not what the definition of feminism is. i think you’re misunderstanding the difference between feminine and feminist. i think the name alone is throwing you off which is okay and understandable.
It's not throwing me off, I am literally saying that the name is horrible & sews division.
i understand. i just feel like the word shouldn’t be an issue. i don’t think we’ll ever fully agree on this, so i don’t want to waste time on it tbh. You’re a great guy, and i appreciate you taking the time to share your view. I learned a lot <3
What we call things is always important. That's why govts literally name everything the opposite of what it is. Currently "trad-wives/girlfriends" & feminists tend to be opposing movements & "feminist" doesn't generally represent anything feminine or nurturing. It tends to signal abortion & other destructive & anti-feminie behaviors & attitudes. Enjoyed the convo 😊
fyi. self-sovereignty is beyond finances. it’s the freedom of our bodies and minds too. regulating wjat femininity is based on your attractions is not being freedom loving or self sovereign. it’s hypocritical to want financial freedom for the masses but reject anything that’s outside of your political views and what you think a woman is.
If all definitions are treated as subjective & abitrary then communication & cooperation completely break down. That is also one of the goals of corrupt politicians & other power hungry people, to shift what some hear when others are trying to communicate with them. This is why they always make up "dog whistles" & attempt to innoculate people against understanding or listening to certain ideas.
I also didn't say anything about what I was attracted to. I tend to prefer women who have some interests that are not traditionally feminine. But I think it's hard to argue that there is anything natural or healthy or sane or feminie about people promoting & celebrating the killing of their own offspring. Even if you think abortion should be allowed, celebrating it is absolutely horrible. There is nothing happy or positive about being in a situation where the "better" choice is to kill your unborn child.
The concept of "the mother" is the natural feminine archetype. That doesn't mean every woman has to want kids, but I do think there are people who want to manipulate women (and young people in general) into acting in ways that are very counter to their nature in order to corrupt & manipulate them. If you are out of touch with your own nature then you are much easier to lead around. "Sexual fluidity" & the idea that there are infinite genders is the new & more potent form of 2+2=5. When you can convince people to deny basic aspects of reality you can get them to do basically anything.
Actually subjective definitions are not antithetical to proper communication. Anarchy of language works. It is when people use force to manipulate language, when people deceive, that communication breaks down.
It is like the subjective theory of value, which when understood and respected, leads to regular prices and economic prosperity and equality. When it is misunderstood and when power to control other people's definitions of value is fought over, dysfunction ensues. Same with the fight for authority over language.
That's fair... deception, or the effort to prevent or confuse translation, or the effort to promote names or labels that obfuscate certain activities rather than properly represent them is definitely at the heart of the problem. Censorship & other things definitely stem from that.
I guess what I meant is that the general/natural goal of communication & language in general is some sort of consensus and to be as objective as possible (even if it's very difficult or even impossible in some sense). The point is to translate or transfer the idea in my head to yours or vice versa with as little loss as possible.
Yeah, totally. Discovering what is real, and what is actually meant by someone. That's kind of the best way to approach everything. I think some feminists do try to understand and take the right approach. I think that the name is confusing because we often get in our heads that benefiting one group or person must come at the expense of another, and that is true when it is done by force, but not true when it is done by voluntary action.
It is ok to be pro-white or pro-woman or to specifically seek to help out blacks, just as long as you don't privilege them with government favor or any other use of force to do it.
For example, the black American family has been systematically decimated by the incentives of the state. A movement to advance black people by voluntary exchange, mutual cooperation, self-reliance, and gun ownership, say something called a "Black Libertarian Movement," (God, please let that become a thing!) can easily be seen to be a good thing. A Marxist statist group aimed at using the state to force companies to prefer black workers and black narratives, on the other hand, is inherently racist because it uses force to treat blacks and all others differently. Such an evil organization might masquerade as something benign and call itself "Black Lives Matter."
Black Guns Matter is a thing 😊
While there is definitely some benefit in meeting people where they are, I still generally think focusing on race or sex or ethnicity has negative long term consequences. Let's say we create an organization of some sort that is crafted to help a particular race or group of people, what happens when things improve or they have been helped? Even if it is privately funded the incentive is to manufacture more problems or exaggerate things in order to chase more funding. Maybe to some degree it is just inevitable, but if you create an organization that is more broadly directed toward promoting responsible gun ownership for everyone then there's no reason it can't continue to help any minority or poorly armed/educated group (Black Guns Matter is actually a great name in that sense).
I generally agree with this perspective, but part of Black Guns Matter is specifically educating people about the racist roots of gun control.
And helping to teach & arm blacks from what I understand, but the play on words makes the organizarion something that could do more.
Yeah, very good points. Oh, Black Guns Matter is a thing? Badass. Cheers!
