Why must I use ApplePay and an app to apply for a visa?

This weekend, I’m travelling to Sydney to interview Yoel Roth for my upcoming Revolution.social podcast. I’m excited to talk to him because, after leaving Twitter, he wrote a paper about the trust and safety challenges facing social media protocols. If we decentralise social media, how do we govern ourselves without relying on centralised systems that can define who has permission to participate?

I need an electronic travel authorization to go to Australia and mine had expired. How hard can it new to renew it? Much harder than it should be.

The thing is, a visa is the most intense kind of government permission. And the permissioned and centralised world of technology almost derailed my entire trip. When I was at the Oslo Freedom Forum, I lost my fiat debit card. It wasn’t a big deal; I blocked it in my bank’s app, and I have other cards, so it wasn’t a major issue. I ordered a replacement card, but my bank requires me to use it physically at a store before they’ll allow me to use the new card for digital payments. And it hasn’t arrived in the post yet. No big deal, I have alternatives, lots of ways of paying for things.

Last night, I remembered to double check my Australian visa. To my surprise, I found out that I needed to renew it. No problem; I went to their website and they directed me to use their mobile app. Fine, I’ll download it again. But here’s where things started to go wrong. Apparently, the Australian government has decided that the visa should only be paid for with an in-app purchase! And because I had frozen my debit card, I couldn’t use that card. My bank wouldn’t unfreeze it because I had ordered a replacement card.

There is a website method, but it lacks any instructions, there are hundreds of questions instead of half a dozen, and it wasn’t clear to me what of the hundreds of Visa options I was supposed to choose.

So I’m waiting for my flight in Auckland but can’t check in because my visa isn’t set up. I need the app and to make an in app purchase!!!

Apple wouldn’t let me re-download the visa app because it has in-app payments and I needed an active card. Now I’ve got like 6 cards in my phone’s digital wallet! But Apple will only let me use a debit card with a New Zealand address! There’s literally an Apple Card with plenty of limit on this phone, but I can’t use it. I tried to use my new NZ company account, but it’s new and I only put $10 to test that it worked right before my trip to OFF! It worked but Apple had more delayed payments than $10, so it quickly declined more payments. Apple still wouldn’t let me re-install the visa app! So I immediately transferred a few hundred dollars from in to the new company account. Normally inter-bank transfers in Australia and New Zealand are immediate because both countries have small banking systems where all banks actually use a single centralized database. Not great for privacy but it’s normally very efficient.

I did an intrabank transfer to my non-blocked company account. But instead of being immediate they said it might take ā€œa few hours!ā€ So I tried adding funds to the new company account using debit or credit cards not those all blocked. Probably money transmitter rules about using cards to fund a bank account vs purchasing. Why provide the option if it won’t go through. Dunno. My guess is the bank was happy to accept it but the credit card companies I use blocked it.

I thought, okay, let me find a pre-paid NZ card. Turns out that there are tons of ways I could be a card issuer of prepaid cards in NZ, but I couldn’t find one which I could get a virtual card online with an NZ address.

Cash App was happy to let me use my BTC to fund some prepaid cards, but they all ended up with European or American issuing banks! Despite being marketed as New Zealand prepaid cards, but they all ended up being either impossible for me to set up to find or not actually based in NZ. Turns out that this stumbling through options lead to me getting a few prepaid no-KYC bitcoin-funded debit cards by accident! All this financial regulation and I stumbled in to anonymous credit cards.

Another option would be just switch my AppStore back to the US. But, Apple won’t let you change your country for your AppleID if you have any active subscriptions. I’ve got a bunch of US cards in my Apple wallet, but I can’t use them.

I missed my flight and had to rebook on a later one, not cheap. But kept going, trying to find a way to install this app. I tried to use my work Apple ID that I use for the nos.social app. While Apple lets you use phone numbers as 2-factor auth, it’s really buggy and doesn’t work for setting up a user in macOS or iOS. They really want you to use the own AppleID everywhere. I could log in to the US Apple account but only via the iCloud website, oh, and Apple Developer Connect. Useless for me in this situation. It wouldn’t take my US AppleID on my laptop or phone.

I also kept trying to find a debit card that Apple NZ would accept, get my personal bank to unblock my card, or even the new business account to work. Nothing.

If I didn’t figure this out, I’d miss my now rescheduled flight.

Eventually, I went through and got the very complicated website to work and spent $200 on a tourist visa. This same visa costs $20 if I use the Apple / Android app and their payment rails! The visa came back confirmed in a couple minutes, after paying the 10x ā€œweb tax.ā€

Right after that, I went through and got confirmation that the bank transfer to my new business account cleared. Honestly, it’s the first time since moving to New Zealand I’ve had an interbank fiat transfer take time; it’s normally immediate! Just when I needed it.

Why is this tech so locked down? Apple won’t let me fund my Apple ā€œiTunesā€ account with my own cards, but only allows local fiat payments. Australia makes it 10 times more expensive to use their website instead of Apple Pay and makes the process much harder!

Billions get laundered through off shore shell companies and Wall Street but somehow banks, credit cards companies, the government of Australia, and Apple all worked to make nearly impossible for me to pay for a $20 visa waiver!? And instead I had to spend $200 on a sketchy website that barely worked.

Now just to be clear. I’m opposed to the existence of borders and nation states being able to control who can live where base on a corrupt system of visas. So my minor frustration is nothing in comparison to what a person from Nigeria or Afghanistan faces when they try and travel. It’s still frustrating.

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I didnt need another reasom to not go to australia but you just gave me one

visa shenanigans are always frustrating pal šŸ«‚ worldwide

Oof šŸ˜“

Glad to read that you’ve finally made it.

Visas are a pain in the neck!

I didnt realise how batshit australia was, until covid times. My little brain had them, until then, as basic Brits with wonky accents, sun tans and liked surfing.

I've since learned more - eg, it is illegal not to vote. And when you do vote - they give you a hotdog.

This is an incentive structure drawn up from dog training. They show you the abyss if you dont do what they want, and they show you a child-level incentive if you do the thing (vote, get vaxxed)

Australia is now a feral, orphaned, authoritarian fork of the british empire. They are now distinct from their origin. They became fascist. They had no "home" to stay loyal to, and with that lost direction, became a concentrated and consolidated independent state.

They are a Galapagos Islands of culture and politics. Broke from the continent, in a bubble. Very similar results in south africa. The colonies were wild racists. Stern, mean, brutal. They werent the same people who lived in Great Britain. They were the soldier ants.

So you put them in shit hot countries where everything is trying to kill you, the weather, the animals, diseases, the locals. The food wont grow, etc.

Should we be surprised these societies actually became (partly), the things they competed against?

England made a fucking mess tbh, started the USA, then lost a fight to it. Same Canada, India, The middle east, Oz, Carribean, Africa.

Brittania covered the globe in structure, definitions of right and wrong (in law), and they broke the rules in front of them. Leaving these child-states as they became teenagers.. Evicted from their futures.

Earth - All the broken children of a massive empire. Now they are all a weird copy of the worst aspects of their father, all fucked up and traumatised.

Not many countries that don't derive their root identities from opposition and independence from Britain - their father nation.

This coffee is amazing - byeeee.

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What a story, what a hussle 😲

Talk about long form.

It was tldr but also tldr didn't want to comment

A small story on why digital peer-2-peer cash might just catch on…

I actually think one of the truly undervalued parts of Nostr is the ID I can trust, combined with the natively connected Bitcoin wallet funded via zaps

It’s like having a public bank account that anyone can fund

What if none of this happened by accident? The universe might be talking to you, and asking you to build something that fixes some of these clown world shenanigans.

Just a thought

What happened? I'm going through my own shit.

Worldwide visas for countries with passports that are not strong is a nightmare šŸ‘ŽšŸ½šŸ‘ŽšŸ½

And you have knowledge about the situation, can you imagine someone completely naive?

The system is rotten and broken! Slow and ineffective. It sucks. Fix the money fix the world šŸ“ā€ā˜ ļø

You don't need to use ApplePay or a mobile app to apply for a visa

The visa is paid for with an in app purchase, which i think is not exactly the same thing as ApplePay but the two overlap.

nostr:npub1yx6pjypd4r7qh2gysjhvjd9l2km6hnm4amdnjyjw3467fy05rf0qfp7kza you’re right. You can as I said pay for the visa via the web using a credit card. But it’s $200 if you do it that way instead of $20!

Sucks to suck sometimes.

Wishing the world was different doesn’t absolve you of your responsibility to follow the rules and jump through the hoops.

First world problems is what you’ve got.

Cheese on bread😨

If only there was another system :)

The purple haired man said the website is too confusing so he HAD to use an app on his iPhone which only let's him pay with Apple pay.

Such a bad take.

1) The website is available if you don't want to use the app. The app is just a convenience tool. Nobody is making you use an app.

2) Your app has to use apple pay, because you're on an iPhone, and yeah... Apple forces people to use Apple pay. Wake the fuck up and get off your iPhone.

Stop pretending that fighting for privacy means complaining about your crappy iPhone experience

What a crazy story. How much time you finally invested into getting on board of a flight?

annoying, but u could have prepared better

wow, that is a crap-ton of complaining about fiat gov’t stupidity that is exactly what you seem to already know to be the truth of such systems. If you quit trying to work within all the rules maybe you wouldn’t be so frustrated? Is interviewing this dude in person THAT important? I didn’t even know about you or him before this rant on Nostr. No offense meant to your hustle, but maybe rethink how important all this is to you and others.

Change phones